5 ms·

you gotta be out of your mind to bug your own house with these devices

by shoulderfake 5y ago

hottesttake 5y ago
Hot take. Any thoughts on the US International Trade Commission's ruling that Google was infringing on Sonos’ patents?
jankyxenon 5y ago
I hear this sentiment a fair bit - but what is the actual risk here?
- zdragnar 5y ago
  - company builds a profile on your likes and dislikes based on commands you give - company surreptitiously builds a profile on everything it hears, ostensibly for "training" their ML / AI - data is viewed by snoopers within the company - data on public figures is leaked to media / public - data is sold to other companies you do business with - data is used to build a "social credit" profile. Say something casuallu offensive? Forget getting that loan! - data is accidentally leaked. Organized theft rings now know your routine, and the routines of everyone in your city all at once. Then there are the odd stories of people who are expecting a baby suddenly getting ads for parenting supplies, or gift surprises being spoiled by recommendations, etc. At the end of the day, FAANG are not my friends. They don't get to know things about me for free, and rarely are the goods they offer worth what they get in exchange. I make some exceptions, but voice assistants aren't one of them.
  - secabeen 5y ago
    > - company surreptitiously builds a profile on everything it hears, ostensibly for "training" their ML / AI I have yet to see any evidence that any voice-command device is transmitting everything it hears. The data sent by the device is too small to contain audio beyond what was said after the wake word was detected. The hardware does not have the necessary chips to do 24x7 voice to text. You're totally right that they can do a lot with what they do get, from the audio around when you say the wake word, and from other data that you give them through web surfing, location data, etc., and that's totally a legitimate reason to not have one or to limit one's interaction.
    - fsflover 5y ago
      http://nymag.com/intelligencer/2018/11/dont-murder-anyone-around-an-echo-during-election-season.html http://nymag.com/intelligencer/2018/11/dont-murder-anyone-ar...
      - treesknees 5y ago
        As your article states, the wake word (and those phonetically similar to it) may activate the voice recording. But the device isn't recording audio 24/7. Presumably other voice assistants like Siri and Google have made advancements in activation hardware/software/algorithms in the 4 years since that article came out.
        fsflover 5y ago
        You never know when it could wake up, so you should assume that it can listen at any time.
    - zdragnar 5y ago
      Maybe it's just my accent, but whenever I'm around someone else's device (Alexa most recently) wakes up multiple times and responds to something we didn't say. The worst part is, when we tell it to stop (potentially flagging it as incorrect), how do we know that conversation isn't being analyzed to "improve" the model? We never used the wake word, so we don't know how long it was listening. It's hard for me to think of them as anything other than creepy. I want to like them; I like the idea of being able to have the convenience of vocal interactions with technology. But, until I'm convinced that it is entirely on my own terms, that's not going to happen.
- vetinari 5y ago
  If you are concerned and just want a speaker, it has hardware switch to turn the mic off.
treesknees 5y ago
I would say it's not much different than having a voice activated assistant in your pocket and on your wrist 24/7. That being said, I do unplug my Google Home Minis when they're not in use.
- HWR_14 5y ago
  Why is there an assumption I have a voice activated assistant in my pocket or on my wrist? And certainly, those options come with a "push to talk" feature.
knowfilter 5y ago
Your phone doesn't have a voice assistant?
psyclobe 5y ago
No, you simply have to desire convenience over privacy.

you gotta be out of your mind to bug your own house with these devices

hottesttake 5y ago

Hot take. Any thoughts on the US International Trade Commission's ruling that Google was infringing on Sonos’ patents?

jankyxenon 5y ago

I hear this sentiment a fair bit - but what is the actual risk here?

zdragnar 5y ago
- company builds a profile on your likes and dislikes based on commands you give - company surreptitiously builds a profile on everything it hears, ostensibly for "training" their ML / AI - data is viewed by snoopers within the company - data on public figures is leaked to media / public - data is sold to other companies you do business with - data is used to build a "social credit" profile. Say something casuallu offensive? Forget getting that loan! - data is accidentally leaked. Organized theft rings now know your routine, and the routines of everyone in your city all at once. Then there are the odd stories of people who are expecting a baby suddenly getting ads for parenting supplies, or gift surprises being spoiled by recommendations, etc. At the end of the day, FAANG are not my friends. They don't get to know things about me for free, and rarely are the goods they offer worth what they get in exchange. I make some exceptions, but voice assistants aren't one of them.
- secabeen 5y ago
  > - company surreptitiously builds a profile on everything it hears, ostensibly for "training" their ML / AI I have yet to see any evidence that any voice-command device is transmitting everything it hears. The data sent by the device is too small to contain audio beyond what was said after the wake word was detected. The hardware does not have the necessary chips to do 24x7 voice to text. You're totally right that they can do a lot with what they do get, from the audio around when you say the wake word, and from other data that you give them through web surfing, location data, etc., and that's totally a legitimate reason to not have one or to limit one's interaction.
  - fsflover 5y ago
    http://nymag.com/intelligencer/2018/11/dont-murder-anyone-around-an-echo-during-election-season.html http://nymag.com/intelligencer/2018/11/dont-murder-anyone-ar...
    - treesknees 5y ago
      As your article states, the wake word (and those phonetically similar to it) may activate the voice recording. But the device isn't recording audio 24/7. Presumably other voice assistants like Siri and Google have made advancements in activation hardware/software/algorithms in the 4 years since that article came out.
      - fsflover 5y ago
        You never know when it could wake up, so you should assume that it can listen at any time.
  - zdragnar 5y ago
    Maybe it's just my accent, but whenever I'm around someone else's device (Alexa most recently) wakes up multiple times and responds to something we didn't say. The worst part is, when we tell it to stop (potentially flagging it as incorrect), how do we know that conversation isn't being analyzed to "improve" the model? We never used the wake word, so we don't know how long it was listening. It's hard for me to think of them as anything other than creepy. I want to like them; I like the idea of being able to have the convenience of vocal interactions with technology. But, until I'm convinced that it is entirely on my own terms, that's not going to happen.
vetinari 5y ago
If you are concerned and just want a speaker, it has hardware switch to turn the mic off.

treesknees 5y ago

I would say it's not much different than having a voice activated assistant in your pocket and on your wrist 24/7. That being said, I do unplug my Google Home Minis when they're not in use.

HWR_14 5y ago
Why is there an assumption I have a voice activated assistant in my pocket or on my wrist? And certainly, those options come with a "push to talk" feature.

knowfilter 5y ago

Your phone doesn't have a voice assistant?

psyclobe 5y ago

No, you simply have to desire convenience over privacy.