3 ms·

The barrier is still close-to-0 to accept donations - the recipient doesn’t need any existing cryptocurrency in order to generate a wallet and start accepting f

by 3np 5y ago

The barrier is still close-to-0 to accept donations - the recipient doesn’t need any existing cryptocurrency in order to generate a wallet and start accepting funds. That aside... Maybe for you, not for me. PayPal and Stripe do require accounts, nondeterministically based on various factors like IP address. For example, I can not use PayPal from my residential IP. Several attempts to address this via phone and email yielded nothing but frustration and lost hours. Not to mention that both are subject to US sanctions laws and thereby legally prohibited from serving individuals and entities who happen to be in or from “the wrong countries”.

shkkmo 5y ago
Having a wallet that can be sent bitcoin doesn't really qualify as "accepting donations" unless you have a way to convert that bitcoin in usable fiat. Thus the barrier is definitely not "close-to-0", especially once you consider potential tax reporting implications.
- 3np 5y ago
  Besides that I disagree with that "easily converting to fiat" is a disqualifier, read on: Assuming that you as recipient don't mind centralized finance and are just interested in getting out fiat: Open account at e.g. Coinbase. Send in crypto. Convert to fiat (e.g. USD). Wire everything to your account. Report the amount you cashed out as if you had received the corresponding amount in fiat directly. This can be done later, or ahead of time. Alternatively, if you really want the full legacy finance experience a la paypal, you can set up an account that auto-converts it to e.g. USD and sends it straight to your account. For you as a recipient, this is pretty much the same experience you would get from say a normal cc provider. IMO it's preferable that individuals control their own keys but to each their own. Yes, this setup doesn't give you as a recipients all the benefits of the crypto-economy - except that you can now receive funds from it, and provide those benefits to your donors.
  - shkkmo 5y ago
    > disagree with that "easily converting to fiat" is a disqualifier, You can't (generally) pay rent or buy groceries with bitcoin. Donations that can't be spent aren't really useful as donations. > Open account at e.g. Coinbase. Send in crypto. Convert to fiat (e.g. USD). Wire everything to your account. Report the amount you cashed out as if you had received the corresponding amount in fiat directly. Which is more work than setting up a PayPal account and is certainly not a "close to 0 barrier" as claimed.
    - maccard 5y ago
      > Which is more work than setting up a PayPal account and is certainly not a "close to 0 barrier" as claimed. Not only that, you don't actually need an account to pay with paypal or stripe. You can do checkout as guest, and enter a card number and be done with it.
    - yebyen 5y ago
      > Donations that can't be spent aren't really useful as donations. And my employer-sponsored 401k account isn't useful to me either... seriously you may not believe in "Bitcoin is sound money" or whatever crypto flavor of the day, but I actually think it might be OK if it necessarily takes most people even a bit longer than a year to figure out how to "cash out" their Bitcoins. I mean that you honestly have to be pretty obtuse to believe (today) that someone who received a bitcoin donation in any year before 2021 (and kept it) received what amounts to a "not really useful donation." Year-on-year, even in a bear market, yada yada – none of these are good reasons for you to BUY bitcoin, but as someone receiving a donation from a human who thought you did a good job, I think maybe "try not to look a gift horse in the mouth" is a valid adage here?
      - shkkmo 5y ago
        You, as someone who likes BitCoin and wants more of it, are perfectly free to have a wallet people can send donations to. You are insisting that people with no interest in owning bitcoins set up wallet, figure out tax rules etc... Just so you can do the the favor of sending them bitcoin. > you honestly have to be pretty obtuse to believe that someone who received a bitcoin donation in any year before 2021 received what amounts to a "not really useful donation." I believe there are tons of people, pre-2021, who received useless bitcoin donations and lost the key before they converted it to an actually useful currency. I don't believe this because "obtuse" or whatever other names you want to call me.
- yebyen 5y ago
  > especially once you consider potential tax reporting implications Do you think the issue of tax reporting for donations is dismissed when you avoid crypto? Unless your project is incorporated as a 501c3 or other non-profit entity (which has its own set of onerous reporting requirements, this is not a backdoor escape hatch) I don't see how that's any less of an issue without cryptos. You can avoid capital gains reporting, but your cash donations are still income and must be counted. They will be taxed.

by 3np 5y ago

shkkmo 5y ago

Having a wallet that can be sent bitcoin doesn't really qualify as "accepting donations" unless you have a way to convert that bitcoin in usable fiat. Thus the barrier is definitely not "close-to-0", especially once you consider potential tax reporting implications.

3np 5y ago
Besides that I disagree with that "easily converting to fiat" is a disqualifier, read on: Assuming that you as recipient don't mind centralized finance and are just interested in getting out fiat: Open account at e.g. Coinbase. Send in crypto. Convert to fiat (e.g. USD). Wire everything to your account. Report the amount you cashed out as if you had received the corresponding amount in fiat directly. This can be done later, or ahead of time. Alternatively, if you really want the full legacy finance experience a la paypal, you can set up an account that auto-converts it to e.g. USD and sends it straight to your account. For you as a recipient, this is pretty much the same experience you would get from say a normal cc provider. IMO it's preferable that individuals control their own keys but to each their own. Yes, this setup doesn't give you as a recipients all the benefits of the crypto-economy - except that you can now receive funds from it, and provide those benefits to your donors.
- shkkmo 5y ago
  > disagree with that "easily converting to fiat" is a disqualifier, You can't (generally) pay rent or buy groceries with bitcoin. Donations that can't be spent aren't really useful as donations. > Open account at e.g. Coinbase. Send in crypto. Convert to fiat (e.g. USD). Wire everything to your account. Report the amount you cashed out as if you had received the corresponding amount in fiat directly. Which is more work than setting up a PayPal account and is certainly not a "close to 0 barrier" as claimed.
  - maccard 5y ago
    > Which is more work than setting up a PayPal account and is certainly not a "close to 0 barrier" as claimed. Not only that, you don't actually need an account to pay with paypal or stripe. You can do checkout as guest, and enter a card number and be done with it.
  - yebyen 5y ago
    > Donations that can't be spent aren't really useful as donations. And my employer-sponsored 401k account isn't useful to me either... seriously you may not believe in "Bitcoin is sound money" or whatever crypto flavor of the day, but I actually think it might be OK if it necessarily takes most people even a bit longer than a year to figure out how to "cash out" their Bitcoins. I mean that you honestly have to be pretty obtuse to believe (today) that someone who received a bitcoin donation in any year before 2021 (and kept it) received what amounts to a "not really useful donation." Year-on-year, even in a bear market, yada yada – none of these are good reasons for you to BUY bitcoin, but as someone receiving a donation from a human who thought you did a good job, I think maybe "try not to look a gift horse in the mouth" is a valid adage here?
    - shkkmo 5y ago
      You, as someone who likes BitCoin and wants more of it, are perfectly free to have a wallet people can send donations to. You are insisting that people with no interest in owning bitcoins set up wallet, figure out tax rules etc... Just so you can do the the favor of sending them bitcoin. > you honestly have to be pretty obtuse to believe that someone who received a bitcoin donation in any year before 2021 received what amounts to a "not really useful donation." I believe there are tons of people, pre-2021, who received useless bitcoin donations and lost the key before they converted it to an actually useful currency. I don't believe this because "obtuse" or whatever other names you want to call me.
yebyen 5y ago
> especially once you consider potential tax reporting implications Do you think the issue of tax reporting for donations is dismissed when you avoid crypto? Unless your project is incorporated as a 501c3 or other non-profit entity (which has its own set of onerous reporting requirements, this is not a backdoor escape hatch) I don't see how that's any less of an issue without cryptos. You can avoid capital gains reporting, but your cash donations are still income and must be counted. They will be taxed.