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Credit, bank checking (ChexSystems), and personal information aggregators like Lexis Nexis and Thomson Reuters Clear ought to be abolished or curbed indeed. I h

Credit, bank checking (ChexSystems), and personal information aggregators like Lexis Nexis and Thomson Reuters Clear ought to be abolished or curbed indeed. I hate to bring trans politics into this. I'm sure that's the last thing anybody wants to hear about right now. However we are a class of people whose sexuality can be unfairly identified by these databases.

A4ET8a8uTh0 5y ago
If this helps, me and my team use LX and some product from TR and for our purposes sex by itself is not a strong driver for anything. That said, I absolutely agree with your initial statement. There is way too much information available just from those two sources and those should be restricted as much as possible. As other users noted, I have personally zero issue when it is an individual case ( my personal misgivings start somewhere where it moves to a political wedge issue ).
replwoacause 5y ago
> However we are a class of people whose sexuality can be unfairly identified by these databases. Good perspective and thanks for sharing it. I am curious about your choice of words though. You said "sexuality" and not "gender identity". Is there some reason why? I've always thought of the term sexuality to be how you feel about others. Or is that what you meant here?
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]
- Pixeleen 5y ago
  Gender identity falls under the umbrella of sexuality. I use less-polite terms to remind people that it's the most excruciatingly private details of my life on some bullshit report. One time while applying for an apartment, a boomer broker sarcastically exclaimed, "Well, THAT'S a valid life choice!" to me. Last year I encountered a professional whose mind was blown by this information and asked me if I've had surgery. It's wrong that this is at the mercy of a newish industry that exists to track individuals' merit in make-believe points.
hluska 5y ago
Trans politics are you politics. Share you politics - they’re important and interesting. :)
uniacid 5y ago
I used to work at Lexis Nexis and I agree since I could see first hand how much personal data and information they have on individuals. They also used theworknumber funny enough for any "employment verification" etc, pretty sure they have a partnership.
throwntoday 5y ago
>I hate to bring trans politics into this. I'm sure that's the last thing anybody wants to hear about right now. You're right. Too bad it didn't stop you from doing it anyway.
- dang 5y ago
  You can't attack other users like that here, and we ban accounts that do it, so please don't do it again. Also: it looks like your account has been using HN primarily for ideological battle. We also ban accounts that do that, regardless of what they're battling for, because it destroys the curious conversation this site is supposed to be for. I'm not going to ban you right now because you've also posted good things, but we need you to be aware of this rule and stop that pattern. More explanation here: https://hn.algolia.com/?sort=byDate&dateRange=all&type=comment&storyText=false&prefix=false&page=0&query=primarily%20test%20by:dang https://hn.algolia.com/?sort=byDate&dateRange=all&type=comme.... https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
  - throwntoday 5y ago
    I just restated what the user themselves admitted. I don't believe that qualifies as an attack. Ideological debates are more likely to get someone to login to respond anyway. And throwaway accounts exist because holding a controversial opinion gets you downvoted automatically. If your intention is to shut down any kind of debate, curious conversation just won't exist here at all.
    - dang 5y ago
      The intention is not to "shut down any kind of debate". This is about comment quality. Your comment was obviously below the bar—it was rude, personal, and added zero information. Please don't post like that here—we're trying for a different kind of conversation. Btw, repeating someone else's self-deprecating remark can absolutely be a form of personal attack; especially if you then pile on, as your comment did. That's not nice at all.
lvncelot 5y ago
> I hate to bring trans politics into this. I'm sure that's the last thing anybody wants to hear about right now. I'm glad you did, as I hadn't thought about that since it isn't part of my day-to-day experience.
wuschel 5y ago
Out of curiosity, what happens if you use a free credit card e.g Barclays? Does living in the EU zone protect you? Do they have access to your bank account information?
- Pixeleen 5y ago
  I'm not familiar with the Barclay card. MasterCard has a service called True Name that lets you put whatever you want on your card. It's proprietary but I don't know if they keep it between the two of you. European countries have much stronger privacy protections, though they might have social security numbers which contain sex as an even/odd digit, and it's difficult to change. Checking account numbers are listed in these systems. Banks guard client account line items closely, although in the US the government has blanket access without a warrant.
  - thendrill 5y ago
    In Norway tax return and salary is a public information available to everyone, handled by the government.
    - abujazar 5y ago
      That’s not precise. Gross income after deductions and taxes paid is public information, salary is not.
- withinboredom 5y ago
  As a US citizen living in the EU. They don’t give two fucks where you live and will happily tell anyone anything that has your social security number. I’ve thought about trying to complain to them about the GDPR… but anyway, if you have a non-US card, the US credit checks won’t register it because the non-US banks don’t report it, even though they know you’re a US citizen. We have a non-US Mastercard and Amex, and they aren’t on our US credit reports. In fact, we no longer have any US debt but our credit scores are less than 500 for paying it all off. It may literally be impossible to move back and have the same quality of life we did when we moved away. Might just stay here forever.
eloff 5y ago
> I hate to bring trans politics into this. I'm sure that's the last thing anybody wants to hear about right now. It bothers me sometimes if other people do that, it does not bother me at all if actual trans people want to talk about it. Thank you for sharing, that angle didn't occur to me.
dr_dshiv 5y ago
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]
- dang 5y ago
  Please do not post flamebait. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
lhh 5y ago
Hopefully TransUnion is more respectful of your rights.
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]
rocqua 5y ago
Is the issue 'just' that they misgender trans people? That alone is already shitty of course. Or is the issue also that it makes later 'verification' by these agencies more difficult if the recorded gender does not match the apparent gender of the person?
- Pixeleen 5y ago
  The issue is that they have a field for prior names/AKA/aliases, and it's typically immutable. You can watch a person's face change as they read the report.
  - rocqua 5y ago
    Whose face to you mean? The person being deadnamed, or the person reading the list of names and realizing the person opposite them is trans? It seems to me that, for the purposes of understanding your legal history it makes sense to keep track of someone's deadname at such an agency. If someone accrued massive debt (or massive positive credit) under their deadname, then that still reflects on them. It sucks to have it recorded that one is trans, or to hear a deadname, but I don't see how it can be avoided.
    - Pixeleen 5y ago
      Like the polite banker opening a checking account for me, or please see my other reply with anecdotes. It does also hurt for me to see that deadname and my thanks for knowing that term. It is not one's legal history. It's a monster of a private industry trying to justify its own existence, which the world turned without for the longest time. There are many other ways that these reports have harmed non-trans people with false or outdated information. If someone accrues massive debt, that's the bank's problem, to recover in collections, the court or with the sheriff, and not by giving someone a virtual scarlet letter. Maybe they shouldn't play this massive game of easy, crippling credit, points and cashback rewards. As to massive positive credit, I couldn't care less whether I have their favor.
      - 5y ago
stef25 5y ago
> However we are a class of people whose sexuality can be unfairly identified by these databases. What do you mean, that you go through life as a woman but that the DB says you were born as a man (for example) ?
deleted 5y ago
[deleted]

A4ET8a8uTh0 5y ago

If this helps, me and my team use LX and some product from TR and for our purposes sex by itself is not a strong driver for anything. That said, I absolutely agree with your initial statement. There is way too much information available just from those two sources and those should be restricted as much as possible. As other users noted, I have personally zero issue when it is an individual case ( my personal misgivings start somewhere where it moves to a political wedge issue ).

replwoacause 5y ago

> However we are a class of people whose sexuality can be unfairly identified by these databases. Good perspective and thanks for sharing it. I am curious about your choice of words though. You said "sexuality" and not "gender identity". Is there some reason why? I've always thought of the term sexuality to be how you feel about others. Or is that what you meant here?

deleted 5y ago
[deleted]
Pixeleen 5y ago
Gender identity falls under the umbrella of sexuality. I use less-polite terms to remind people that it's the most excruciatingly private details of my life on some bullshit report. One time while applying for an apartment, a boomer broker sarcastically exclaimed, "Well, THAT'S a valid life choice!" to me. Last year I encountered a professional whose mind was blown by this information and asked me if I've had surgery. It's wrong that this is at the mercy of a newish industry that exists to track individuals' merit in make-believe points.

hluska 5y ago

Trans politics are you politics. Share you politics - they’re important and interesting. :)

uniacid 5y ago

I used to work at Lexis Nexis and I agree since I could see first hand how much personal data and information they have on individuals. They also used theworknumber funny enough for any "employment verification" etc, pretty sure they have a partnership.

throwntoday 5y ago

>I hate to bring trans politics into this. I'm sure that's the last thing anybody wants to hear about right now. You're right. Too bad it didn't stop you from doing it anyway.

dang 5y ago
You can't attack other users like that here, and we ban accounts that do it, so please don't do it again. Also: it looks like your account has been using HN primarily for ideological battle. We also ban accounts that do that, regardless of what they're battling for, because it destroys the curious conversation this site is supposed to be for. I'm not going to ban you right now because you've also posted good things, but we need you to be aware of this rule and stop that pattern. More explanation here: https://hn.algolia.com/?sort=byDate&dateRange=all&type=comment&storyText=false&prefix=false&page=0&query=primarily%20test%20by:dang https://hn.algolia.com/?sort=byDate&dateRange=all&type=comme.... https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
- throwntoday 5y ago
  I just restated what the user themselves admitted. I don't believe that qualifies as an attack. Ideological debates are more likely to get someone to login to respond anyway. And throwaway accounts exist because holding a controversial opinion gets you downvoted automatically. If your intention is to shut down any kind of debate, curious conversation just won't exist here at all.
  - dang 5y ago
    The intention is not to "shut down any kind of debate". This is about comment quality. Your comment was obviously below the bar—it was rude, personal, and added zero information. Please don't post like that here—we're trying for a different kind of conversation. Btw, repeating someone else's self-deprecating remark can absolutely be a form of personal attack; especially if you then pile on, as your comment did. That's not nice at all.

lvncelot 5y ago

> I hate to bring trans politics into this. I'm sure that's the last thing anybody wants to hear about right now. I'm glad you did, as I hadn't thought about that since it isn't part of my day-to-day experience.

wuschel 5y ago

Out of curiosity, what happens if you use a free credit card e.g Barclays? Does living in the EU zone protect you? Do they have access to your bank account information?

Pixeleen 5y ago
I'm not familiar with the Barclay card. MasterCard has a service called True Name that lets you put whatever you want on your card. It's proprietary but I don't know if they keep it between the two of you. European countries have much stronger privacy protections, though they might have social security numbers which contain sex as an even/odd digit, and it's difficult to change. Checking account numbers are listed in these systems. Banks guard client account line items closely, although in the US the government has blanket access without a warrant.
- thendrill 5y ago
  In Norway tax return and salary is a public information available to everyone, handled by the government.
  - abujazar 5y ago
    That’s not precise. Gross income after deductions and taxes paid is public information, salary is not.
withinboredom 5y ago
As a US citizen living in the EU. They don’t give two fucks where you live and will happily tell anyone anything that has your social security number. I’ve thought about trying to complain to them about the GDPR… but anyway, if you have a non-US card, the US credit checks won’t register it because the non-US banks don’t report it, even though they know you’re a US citizen. We have a non-US Mastercard and Amex, and they aren’t on our US credit reports. In fact, we no longer have any US debt but our credit scores are less than 500 for paying it all off. It may literally be impossible to move back and have the same quality of life we did when we moved away. Might just stay here forever.

eloff 5y ago

> I hate to bring trans politics into this. I'm sure that's the last thing anybody wants to hear about right now. It bothers me sometimes if other people do that, it does not bother me at all if actual trans people want to talk about it. Thank you for sharing, that angle didn't occur to me.

dr_dshiv 5y ago

deleted 5y ago
[deleted]
dang 5y ago
Please do not post flamebait. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

lhh 5y ago

Hopefully TransUnion is more respectful of your rights.

deleted 5y ago
[deleted]

rocqua 5y ago

Is the issue 'just' that they misgender trans people? That alone is already shitty of course. Or is the issue also that it makes later 'verification' by these agencies more difficult if the recorded gender does not match the apparent gender of the person?

Pixeleen 5y ago
The issue is that they have a field for prior names/AKA/aliases, and it's typically immutable. You can watch a person's face change as they read the report.
- rocqua 5y ago
  Whose face to you mean? The person being deadnamed, or the person reading the list of names and realizing the person opposite them is trans? It seems to me that, for the purposes of understanding your legal history it makes sense to keep track of someone's deadname at such an agency. If someone accrued massive debt (or massive positive credit) under their deadname, then that still reflects on them. It sucks to have it recorded that one is trans, or to hear a deadname, but I don't see how it can be avoided.
  - Pixeleen 5y ago
    Like the polite banker opening a checking account for me, or please see my other reply with anecdotes. It does also hurt for me to see that deadname and my thanks for knowing that term. It is not one's legal history. It's a monster of a private industry trying to justify its own existence, which the world turned without for the longest time. There are many other ways that these reports have harmed non-trans people with false or outdated information. If someone accrues massive debt, that's the bank's problem, to recover in collections, the court or with the sheriff, and not by giving someone a virtual scarlet letter. Maybe they shouldn't play this massive game of easy, crippling credit, points and cashback rewards. As to massive positive credit, I couldn't care less whether I have their favor.
    - 5y ago

stef25 5y ago

> However we are a class of people whose sexuality can be unfairly identified by these databases. What do you mean, that you go through life as a woman but that the DB says you were born as a man (for example) ?

deleted 5y ago

[deleted]