4 ms·

If you just autosell it, why would you prefer straight salary? Is it concerns over stock fluctuations? I too always sell immediately as I prefer to be diversif

by wepple 5y ago

If you just autosell it, why would you prefer straight salary? Is it concerns over stock fluctuations? I too always sell immediately as I prefer to be diversified (but I also don’t work at an extreme high growth company)

beebmam 5y ago
Vesting is an anti-competitive practice for retaining laborers and we should be shaming all companies that practice it.
- xboxnolifes 5y ago
  Vesting can happen linearly and be no different from a more volatile salary.
  - Broken_Hippo 5y ago
    To be fair, paying someone a volatile salary (for example, mostly or all commission) should be banned as well.
    - xboxnolifes 5y ago
      For what reason?
      - Broken_Hippo 5y ago
        Because it creates instability in someone's life and easily causes folks to work for hours just to have no paycheck if they didn't sell a car (for example). Another example is a cleaning service: I knew someone that worked for one. She got paid a percentage of the cost - she had a schedule, but folks cancelled and other such things. It wound up that she was stuck at work in between jobs, couldn't go home, yet wasn't getting paid. In other words, it creates a job environment that easily exploits people. I'm not absolutely offended by bonuses and commissions, mind you, but base pay realistically should make up the majority to most of the salary and be fairly consistent from week to week. Pay based on tips can do the same thing (and you can cause this to happen to tipped employees with scheduling).
- mgfist 5y ago
  Vesting has upsides. Your company essentially fronts you free capital on the stipulation that you invest it in the company's stock with specific lockups. Essentially it comes down to two choices: do you think cash over the course of your vest cycle will perform better than the company's stock. If you believe cash will do better, then RSUs are worse than cash bonuses. Otherwise the RSUs do better.
  - deleted 5y ago
    [deleted]
- slt2021 5y ago
  you can just not apply to work there if that is your opinion. plenty of other people have different opinion. no need to shame, this cancerous cancel culture must die
Arainach 5y ago
If nothing else, it's more pain when it comes time to file my taxes. With autosell and RSUs vesting monthly, filling out my stock sales takes as long as the rest of my return combined.
- notJim 5y ago
  This is a problem for your accountant :)
  - jrockway 5y ago
    People learn this the hard way. These companies that pay you in 50% stock should probably have some checkbox on the employment agreement that says "I agree to get a licensed accountant to do my taxes every year, and I realize that I will be paying for this out of pocket." The most complex tax disaster I got into cost $700 to resolve, and that is a tiny tiny fraction of what they pay you in stock, so just do it.
- coryrc 5y ago
  I don't have to do anything, I get a single form (1099? Don't remember) per source with gains and that's it. Don't even have to send in those forms with the return anymore. Is there some number where you have to fill out stock sales?
- MarkSweep 5y ago
  I’m not a tax expert. but if I’m understanding the directions on Schedule D and form 8949 correctly, if everything on your 1099-B was reported to the IRS (box A or D checked) and you don’t need to make any adjustment to basis, you can just put the grand total on Schedule D, without reporting each transaction on Form 8949. Turbo Tax seems to take this approach, at least when I filed last year.
  - dmoy 5y ago
    RSU are non-covered shares, so you can't just fill out the total on schedule D (box a or d won't be checked) You can do the above and also send the IRS a copy of your 1099-B too, along with your 1040. I don't know if you can do that and e-file.
nsxwolf 5y ago
Now that I'm more than halfway through my working life, my walls are papered with worthless equity grants. I've never seen a penny and I'm under no illusions that I ever will. I no longer consider them at all when negotiating compensation. I interpret their very mention as a trick to get me to devalue myself.
- bognition 5y ago
  How many of these grants were for RSUs in a publicly traded company?
- slt2021 5y ago
  startup equity grants are lottery tickets and must be treated as such. Public equity grants are as good as cash
- philjohn 5y ago
  That's different from a publicly traded company RSU, where on each vest date you are employed you will get a % of your initial grant (+ refreshers) - tax withholding distributed to your brokerage account. It accounts for more than 50% of my total compensation.

by wepple 5y ago

beebmam 5y ago

Vesting is an anti-competitive practice for retaining laborers and we should be shaming all companies that practice it.

xboxnolifes 5y ago
Vesting can happen linearly and be no different from a more volatile salary.
- Broken_Hippo 5y ago
  To be fair, paying someone a volatile salary (for example, mostly or all commission) should be banned as well.
  - xboxnolifes 5y ago
    For what reason?
    - Broken_Hippo 5y ago
      Because it creates instability in someone's life and easily causes folks to work for hours just to have no paycheck if they didn't sell a car (for example). Another example is a cleaning service: I knew someone that worked for one. She got paid a percentage of the cost - she had a schedule, but folks cancelled and other such things. It wound up that she was stuck at work in between jobs, couldn't go home, yet wasn't getting paid. In other words, it creates a job environment that easily exploits people. I'm not absolutely offended by bonuses and commissions, mind you, but base pay realistically should make up the majority to most of the salary and be fairly consistent from week to week. Pay based on tips can do the same thing (and you can cause this to happen to tipped employees with scheduling).
mgfist 5y ago
Vesting has upsides. Your company essentially fronts you free capital on the stipulation that you invest it in the company's stock with specific lockups. Essentially it comes down to two choices: do you think cash over the course of your vest cycle will perform better than the company's stock. If you believe cash will do better, then RSUs are worse than cash bonuses. Otherwise the RSUs do better.
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]
slt2021 5y ago
you can just not apply to work there if that is your opinion. plenty of other people have different opinion. no need to shame, this cancerous cancel culture must die

Arainach 5y ago

If nothing else, it's more pain when it comes time to file my taxes. With autosell and RSUs vesting monthly, filling out my stock sales takes as long as the rest of my return combined.

notJim 5y ago
This is a problem for your accountant :)
- jrockway 5y ago
  People learn this the hard way. These companies that pay you in 50% stock should probably have some checkbox on the employment agreement that says "I agree to get a licensed accountant to do my taxes every year, and I realize that I will be paying for this out of pocket." The most complex tax disaster I got into cost $700 to resolve, and that is a tiny tiny fraction of what they pay you in stock, so just do it.
coryrc 5y ago
I don't have to do anything, I get a single form (1099? Don't remember) per source with gains and that's it. Don't even have to send in those forms with the return anymore. Is there some number where you have to fill out stock sales?
MarkSweep 5y ago
I’m not a tax expert. but if I’m understanding the directions on Schedule D and form 8949 correctly, if everything on your 1099-B was reported to the IRS (box A or D checked) and you don’t need to make any adjustment to basis, you can just put the grand total on Schedule D, without reporting each transaction on Form 8949. Turbo Tax seems to take this approach, at least when I filed last year.
- dmoy 5y ago
  RSU are non-covered shares, so you can't just fill out the total on schedule D (box a or d won't be checked) You can do the above and also send the IRS a copy of your 1099-B too, along with your 1040. I don't know if you can do that and e-file.

nsxwolf 5y ago

Now that I'm more than halfway through my working life, my walls are papered with worthless equity grants. I've never seen a penny and I'm under no illusions that I ever will. I no longer consider them at all when negotiating compensation. I interpret their very mention as a trick to get me to devalue myself.

bognition 5y ago
How many of these grants were for RSUs in a publicly traded company?
slt2021 5y ago
startup equity grants are lottery tickets and must be treated as such. Public equity grants are as good as cash
philjohn 5y ago
That's different from a publicly traded company RSU, where on each vest date you are employed you will get a % of your initial grant (+ refreshers) - tax withholding distributed to your brokerage account. It accounts for more than 50% of my total compensation.