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So the "killer feature" that the Swiss Army used to justify Threema over Signal and the others is that it's Swiss based and not US based like the others, not a

So the "killer feature" that the Swiss Army used to justify Threema over Signal and the others is that it's Swiss based and not US based like the others, not a technical feature that guarantees better proven security. I don't blame them one second for going local, but then if security and ownership of your comms is what you're after, why not set up your own Matrix server for comms for your military personnel like every European country (I think), and instead purchase Threema licenses? I feel this is basically a form of corporate sponsorship/handouts from the government/defense sector in disguise, to support a local champion (basically how the US defense sector propped up Silicon Valley in its inception).

frabcus 5y ago
It’s a military reason. In the event of war you want complete control of comms systems for your military. This makes sense to me! I think it would be foolish of any army to use a comms system another country controls.
- Jtsummers 5y ago
  There are multiple reasons, and that would be one of them. Another reason is legal/regulatory: Most government and military employees (especially in countries that at least want to have the appearance of opposing corruption) have specific record keeping requirements. If you use unofficial channels for official communications, you are almost certainly violating those rules and laws. "Where's lunch today?", not an issue. "Let's discuss these budget items and make a decision", that's an issue. I don't know Swiss laws and rules, but I'd be surprised if they permitted, say, coordination of movement of military assets (in country, peace time) via unofficial, unrecorded methods.
- cm2187 5y ago
  If they run on iOS or Android, you'd better make sure the US isn't on the other side of that war.
danuker 5y ago
I see Threema does not require your phone number, but it wants you to download the App/Play Store version. Whereas with WhatsApp you can download the APK file from the site. This is not only identifies you through Google/Apple services, but is also fundamentally incompatible with software freedom, as few can audit the binaries they receive. Unless you build your own binaries from the open source project (which has its issue tracker disabled for the public), you are out of luck.
- chrisseaton 5y ago
  > fundamentally incompatible with software freedom Was software freedom a goal?
- cpach 5y ago
  There are lots of people who know how to audit binaries. It’s not as if auditing source code is something that most people can do.
- glitchc 5y ago
  Not true. You can download the APK directly right here: https://shop.threema.ch/download https://shop.threema.ch/download
- tylersmith 5y ago
  It's very unlikely that those are concerns for the Swiss army.
trasz 5y ago
How is not releasing all your communications away to a different country "just politics"?
_jal 5y ago
> ultimately just politics 101 In the same way that war is just politics by other means, yes. Wars are about logistics. If you think business is hard with the current disruption of our just-in-time economy when most actors are actually trying to cooperate, think about your competitor subverting, buying or bombing your third party communications service providers.
newsclues 5y ago
As a Canadian I’ve been advocating for a similar local solution to Twitter/Facebook/YouTube for political messaging. Keep the data and money local!
zaik 5y ago
XMPP seems to be quite popular with military organizations: https://www.isode.com/whitepapers/military-forms-using-xmpp.html https://www.isode.com/whitepapers/military-forms-using-xmpp....
FinnKuhn 5y ago
This comment made me really curious what my countries military uses and I need to say I am pleasantly surprised that the German military’s messenger seems to be done in house and based on Matrix. https://apps.apple.com/de/app/bwmessenger/id1518548153?l=en https://apps.apple.com/de/app/bwmessenger/id1518548153?l=en

frabcus 5y ago

It’s a military reason. In the event of war you want complete control of comms systems for your military. This makes sense to me! I think it would be foolish of any army to use a comms system another country controls.

Jtsummers 5y ago
There are multiple reasons, and that would be one of them. Another reason is legal/regulatory: Most government and military employees (especially in countries that at least want to have the appearance of opposing corruption) have specific record keeping requirements. If you use unofficial channels for official communications, you are almost certainly violating those rules and laws. "Where's lunch today?", not an issue. "Let's discuss these budget items and make a decision", that's an issue. I don't know Swiss laws and rules, but I'd be surprised if they permitted, say, coordination of movement of military assets (in country, peace time) via unofficial, unrecorded methods.
cm2187 5y ago
If they run on iOS or Android, you'd better make sure the US isn't on the other side of that war.

danuker 5y ago

I see Threema does not require your phone number, but it wants you to download the App/Play Store version. Whereas with WhatsApp you can download the APK file from the site. This is not only identifies you through Google/Apple services, but is also fundamentally incompatible with software freedom, as few can audit the binaries they receive. Unless you build your own binaries from the open source project (which has its issue tracker disabled for the public), you are out of luck.

chrisseaton 5y ago
> fundamentally incompatible with software freedom Was software freedom a goal?
cpach 5y ago
There are lots of people who know how to audit binaries. It’s not as if auditing source code is something that most people can do.
glitchc 5y ago
Not true. You can download the APK directly right here: https://shop.threema.ch/download https://shop.threema.ch/download
tylersmith 5y ago
It's very unlikely that those are concerns for the Swiss army.

trasz 5y ago

How is not releasing all your communications away to a different country "just politics"?

_jal 5y ago

> ultimately just politics 101 In the same way that war is just politics by other means, yes. Wars are about logistics. If you think business is hard with the current disruption of our just-in-time economy when most actors are actually trying to cooperate, think about your competitor subverting, buying or bombing your third party communications service providers.

newsclues 5y ago

As a Canadian I’ve been advocating for a similar local solution to Twitter/Facebook/YouTube for political messaging. Keep the data and money local!

zaik 5y ago

XMPP seems to be quite popular with military organizations: https://www.isode.com/whitepapers/military-forms-using-xmpp.html https://www.isode.com/whitepapers/military-forms-using-xmpp....

FinnKuhn 5y ago

This comment made me really curious what my countries military uses and I need to say I am pleasantly surprised that the German military’s messenger seems to be done in house and based on Matrix. https://apps.apple.com/de/app/bwmessenger/id1518548153?l=en https://apps.apple.com/de/app/bwmessenger/id1518548153?l=en