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> "My biggest gripe is that Leetcode is systematically favoring candidates who have months of free time to memorize arbitrary logic puzzles. It makes me sad for

> "My biggest gripe is that Leetcode is systematically favoring candidates who have months of free time to memorize arbitrary logic puzzles. It makes me sad for the less privileged candidates who might be working a job while also trying to break into the IT field." I told google that this style of interviewing is discriminatory, especially towards people with families, or other commitments. Never got another call for an interview since ^_^

sorry_outta_gas 5y ago
the best part is that when you're done with the on-site you get a survey with a question like "do you think google's making the world a better place?" hah personally I think they do make some pretty cool things here and there but they do have very pretentious vibe all throughout the phase of technology that they own/owned is nearing end soon anyway
- chiph 5y ago
  > do you think google's making the world a better place? Silicon Valley, season 1 episode 1: "But most importantly we're making the world a better place. Through constructing elegant hierarchies for maximum code reuse and extensibility." Mike Judge is a genius.
  - jasonladuke0311 5y ago
    > Mike Judge is a genius. He really is. Any one of his properties would prove that by itself. Having such keen insights into disparate facets of humanity tells me that he just gets humans on a level not many other people do. Hopefully that doesn’t sound too flowery and pretentious.
    - astronautjones 5y ago
      When I last saw geto boys live, willie d introduced the set by saying "we know why y'all are here, that's why this is the office space tour. and you know mike judge is the greatest satirist of this generation, watch silicon valley sundays on hbo" and then they went into "still" and bushwick bill beat up a printer on stage with a baseball bat. it was transcendent.
    - celim307 5y ago
      I think he nails satire and weirdness of humans well, similar to apatow, but I think he falls flat on the more emotional or positive aspects of humanity. Not to say he’s not a master of his craft, and king of the hill especially had tender moments, but maybe that’s just not what he’s interested in
      - jasonladuke0311 5y ago
        > I think he nails satire and weirdness of humans well, similar to apatow, but I think he falls flat on the more emotional or positive aspects of humanity. That's a fair criticism. Much of his work comes off as deeply cynical.
      - dustymcp 5y ago
        He makes comedy, not drama?
reaperducer 5y ago
I told one that I am a human being, not a circus animal here to do tricks, and if they want me to do live coding, they'd have to pay me for my time. Same result as you: The recruiters stopped bothering me.
- igorstellar 5y ago
  Actually, that's not a half bad idea. If phone interview is passed, on-site time should be paid since the market is too hot. I wasted about 5 hours with Google (I did get an offer after the interview) but it was horrible experience (2019). Maybe if I was paid for that time I could at least justify this incredible time-waste. For example, companies do pay for people to fly-in for onsite interviews, so they do have budget for that. UPD: I have provided negative feedback to my recruiter and they still reaching out to me. Really doubt companies ever act on any of candidate feedbacks since candidates are not employee (I know my previous company didn't, asking for feedback was just a "wanna look good in your eyes" question).
  - ThrowawayR2 5y ago
    > "If phone interview is passed, on-site time should be paid since the market is too hot." And what happens later when the market is not so hot? I was around for both the dot com bust and 2008 recession. The current hot market should not be taken for granted; it isn't going to last forever.
- noidea_ 5y ago
- khazhoux 5y ago
  I'm not a huge fan of coding tests, but as a hiring manager, we do them during my team's interviews. I'm not looking for a leetcoder. But I've had to reject candidates who otherwise seemed really strong, but then it turns out that they completely struggled with every aspect of a simple python question.
  - 5y ago
rjzzleep 5y ago
When Amazon reached out to me I told them happy to talk to them, but I don't do coding tests. No response since then. I think it was a friends recommendation though, so in hindsight, maybe I should have at least listened.
- behringer 5y ago
  I wouldn't feel bad. Friends don't tell friends to work at Amazon. :P
  - thekingofravens 5y ago
    That depends what they know. As this article describes, Amazon is like a federation of mini-companies. So the right team is Great.
coliveira 5y ago
> I told google that this style of interviewing is discriminatory, especially towards people with families But this is exactly the point, to be discriminatory while using a valid excuse for doing so.
mikesabbagh 5y ago
why do you want to work for Amazon and Google when there are so many great companies that would appreciate you every day (and pay you more)
- throw1234651234 5y ago
  (and pay you more). No.
- jrockway 5y ago
  Who is paying more than Amazon and Google right now? Investment banks, maybe?
  - free652 5y ago
    Quants: Citadel and Jane Street.
    - bimboler38 5y ago
      GL getting in. The interviews are arguably harder than that of FAANG.
  - tfehring 5y ago
    https://levels.fyi/2021 https://levels.fyi/2021 Also my impression is that Amazon’s effective comp is significantly below the headline number because they heavily backload RSUs and they burn out or fire so many people in the first couple years.
    - oangemangut 5y ago
      usually the signing bonus they offer for years 1 and 2 makes up for the backloaded RSU schedule... at least that's mostly how my offer worked circa 2019
  - decafninja 5y ago
    Haha, investment banks do not pay SWEs well at all (outside of certain rare elite niche roles anyways). You'll be lucky to make half the compensation a FAANG engineer makes at a typical investment bank while always being treated as a second class cost center employee. Amongst the FAANG companies, my understanding for compensation is: Netflix, Facebook > Google > Apple, Amazon ...adding in the MULA companies, believe Uber, Lyft, and Airbnb are towards the upper end of the spectrum while Microsoft is towards the lower. Correct me if I'm wrong.

sorry_outta_gas 5y ago

the best part is that when you're done with the on-site you get a survey with a question like "do you think google's making the world a better place?" hah personally I think they do make some pretty cool things here and there but they do have very pretentious vibe all throughout the phase of technology that they own/owned is nearing end soon anyway

chiph 5y ago
> do you think google's making the world a better place? Silicon Valley, season 1 episode 1: "But most importantly we're making the world a better place. Through constructing elegant hierarchies for maximum code reuse and extensibility." Mike Judge is a genius.
- jasonladuke0311 5y ago
  > Mike Judge is a genius. He really is. Any one of his properties would prove that by itself. Having such keen insights into disparate facets of humanity tells me that he just gets humans on a level not many other people do. Hopefully that doesn’t sound too flowery and pretentious.
  - astronautjones 5y ago
    When I last saw geto boys live, willie d introduced the set by saying "we know why y'all are here, that's why this is the office space tour. and you know mike judge is the greatest satirist of this generation, watch silicon valley sundays on hbo" and then they went into "still" and bushwick bill beat up a printer on stage with a baseball bat. it was transcendent.
  - celim307 5y ago
    I think he nails satire and weirdness of humans well, similar to apatow, but I think he falls flat on the more emotional or positive aspects of humanity. Not to say he’s not a master of his craft, and king of the hill especially had tender moments, but maybe that’s just not what he’s interested in
    - jasonladuke0311 5y ago
      > I think he nails satire and weirdness of humans well, similar to apatow, but I think he falls flat on the more emotional or positive aspects of humanity. That's a fair criticism. Much of his work comes off as deeply cynical.
    - dustymcp 5y ago
      He makes comedy, not drama?

reaperducer 5y ago

I told one that I am a human being, not a circus animal here to do tricks, and if they want me to do live coding, they'd have to pay me for my time. Same result as you: The recruiters stopped bothering me.

igorstellar 5y ago
Actually, that's not a half bad idea. If phone interview is passed, on-site time should be paid since the market is too hot. I wasted about 5 hours with Google (I did get an offer after the interview) but it was horrible experience (2019). Maybe if I was paid for that time I could at least justify this incredible time-waste. For example, companies do pay for people to fly-in for onsite interviews, so they do have budget for that. UPD: I have provided negative feedback to my recruiter and they still reaching out to me. Really doubt companies ever act on any of candidate feedbacks since candidates are not employee (I know my previous company didn't, asking for feedback was just a "wanna look good in your eyes" question).
- ThrowawayR2 5y ago
  > "If phone interview is passed, on-site time should be paid since the market is too hot." And what happens later when the market is not so hot? I was around for both the dot com bust and 2008 recession. The current hot market should not be taken for granted; it isn't going to last forever.
noidea_ 5y ago
khazhoux 5y ago
I'm not a huge fan of coding tests, but as a hiring manager, we do them during my team's interviews. I'm not looking for a leetcoder. But I've had to reject candidates who otherwise seemed really strong, but then it turns out that they completely struggled with every aspect of a simple python question.
- 5y ago

rjzzleep 5y ago

When Amazon reached out to me I told them happy to talk to them, but I don't do coding tests. No response since then. I think it was a friends recommendation though, so in hindsight, maybe I should have at least listened.

behringer 5y ago
I wouldn't feel bad. Friends don't tell friends to work at Amazon. :P
- thekingofravens 5y ago
  That depends what they know. As this article describes, Amazon is like a federation of mini-companies. So the right team is Great.

coliveira 5y ago

> I told google that this style of interviewing is discriminatory, especially towards people with families But this is exactly the point, to be discriminatory while using a valid excuse for doing so.

mikesabbagh 5y ago

why do you want to work for Amazon and Google when there are so many great companies that would appreciate you every day (and pay you more)

throw1234651234 5y ago
(and pay you more). No.
jrockway 5y ago
Who is paying more than Amazon and Google right now? Investment banks, maybe?
- free652 5y ago
  Quants: Citadel and Jane Street.
  - bimboler38 5y ago
    GL getting in. The interviews are arguably harder than that of FAANG.
- tfehring 5y ago
  https://levels.fyi/2021 https://levels.fyi/2021 Also my impression is that Amazon’s effective comp is significantly below the headline number because they heavily backload RSUs and they burn out or fire so many people in the first couple years.
  - oangemangut 5y ago
    usually the signing bonus they offer for years 1 and 2 makes up for the backloaded RSU schedule... at least that's mostly how my offer worked circa 2019
- decafninja 5y ago
  Haha, investment banks do not pay SWEs well at all (outside of certain rare elite niche roles anyways). You'll be lucky to make half the compensation a FAANG engineer makes at a typical investment bank while always being treated as a second class cost center employee. Amongst the FAANG companies, my understanding for compensation is: Netflix, Facebook > Google > Apple, Amazon ...adding in the MULA companies, believe Uber, Lyft, and Airbnb are towards the upper end of the spectrum while Microsoft is towards the lower. Correct me if I'm wrong.