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What you wrote confirms what I thought, sorry. You seem incredibly bitter, and I'm also sorry that you feel that way. If software isn't for you, it isn't for yo

What you wrote confirms what I thought, sorry. You seem incredibly bitter, and I'm also sorry that you feel that way. If software isn't for you, it isn't for you. I come from an era when I was considered a weird nerd because I understood and liked "programming". The idea that everyone should like it is bizarre and foreign to me. There is worthwhile software, and I have written some. But worth it is in the eye of the creator, and so I maybe I find worth where you don't. What is the "easiest" discipline is a nonsensical question to me.

deltaonefour 5y ago
>If software isn't for you, it isn't for you. See this is a straight up insult. How do you know software isn't for me? You only say this to be manipulative and insulting. I love software, I'm just not delusional. Software is easy. Let me tell you the extent in which I love software, I study haskell in my freetime. I study formal methods. I study graphics programming all of which are unrelated to anything practical to my current career trajectory. >There is worthwhile software, and I have written some. But worth it is in the eye of the creator, and so I maybe I find worth where you don't. I defined it in a way where it isn't defined by the eye of the beholder. What "worthwhile" software have you written that very few people in the industry can write? I bet you all the stuff you wrote, any mediocre software engineer can write. Which illustrates my point. >What is the "easiest" discipline is a nonsensical question to me. Of course it's nonsensical to you. How convenient. Because answering this question would defeat your argument or display how much knowledge you lack for other forms of engineering. The answer is: "software engineering" It's like refusing to answer the question which is harder: Calculus or algebra? Well they are two different subjects and I am a logical automaton I can't determine which is harder so I am labeling the question as nonsensical even though the entire face of the earth OBVIOUSLY knows calculus is harder. Well guess what you're not a robot. Don't hide behind that as an excuse. Calculus is harder than algebra just like how software engineering is the easiest engineering discipline out there. Even "worthwhile" software that you write is easy.
- gilbetron 5y ago
  Calculus and algebra were easy. I know you haven't written worthwhile software (yet), since you say writing software is easy. Write something worthwhile and then come back and let me know how easy it was. Although, to be fair, some worthwhile software is easy to write, it's just figuring out what to write is really hard ... but that's one of the reasons why the discipline is hard!
  - deltaonefour 5y ago
    >I know you haven't written worthwhile software (yet), since you say writing software is easy. lol. You're a genius. I've stated this multiple times. Software engineering is EASIER than other forms of engineering. This is a bit different than just being "easy" and while I've used the word "easy" you know my intent. I am also absolutely positive all the worthwhile software you have or yet to have written, any mediocre software engineer can do. Just name all the stuff you done. Anyone can do it. Let's look at your stuff: https://github.com/gilbitron https://github.com/gilbitron This is you right? Well when I think of impressive "worthwhile" software I think in terms of kernels, 3D rendering engines, a compiler that kind of thing. Those are things I would argue that actually promote your argument as less software engineers know how to program this stuff. But looking at that site looks like you mostly do typical generic webdev stuff. Web dev is one of the easiest areas of software engineering. Also you're a vue guy and php. Vuejs is the typical choice for old school web dev guys who do php. I assure you all the stuff you built, anyone can do it. Doesn't even come close to "worthwhile." Because anyone can do it, that is why it's easy. You can call it hard. But that's fine it just becomes a word game. Let me put it this way, ALL the software you have done may be "hard" but it's easy enough that any mediocre software engineer out of bootcamp can implement everything you wrote from scratch. >Calculus and algebra were easy. Nowhere near as easy as programming. The math involved with engineering goes much deeper than highschool algebra and calculus. I know you haven't done anything worthwhile in engineering besides webdev because you called it easy.
    - gilbetron 5y ago
      > And that is why software is easy. > That's why it's easy. > Software engineering is a shot in the dark and therefore easy. > Software engineering as it stands is easy. > Nobody in this area of software truly knows what they are doing. Hence why it's easy. > Let me be clear about what I mean by easy. Easy means anyone can do it. If a lot of hardwork and problem solving effort is involved... it doesn't matter and it's still easy because anyone can do it. Seems like you think it is easy. And no, that's not me that you linked. Although I have done webdev work in my career, and only easy webdev work is easy. There is plenty that is difficult in webdev. Also I've created a 3D renderer from scratch (a complete 3D engine, in fact, including networking), a flight simulator, an ISAR simulator, software for force feedback, and a genetic samples assembler - and that's just the stuff from before stack overflow existed.

deltaonefour 5y ago

>If software isn't for you, it isn't for you. See this is a straight up insult. How do you know software isn't for me? You only say this to be manipulative and insulting. I love software, I'm just not delusional. Software is easy. Let me tell you the extent in which I love software, I study haskell in my freetime. I study formal methods. I study graphics programming all of which are unrelated to anything practical to my current career trajectory. >There is worthwhile software, and I have written some. But worth it is in the eye of the creator, and so I maybe I find worth where you don't. I defined it in a way where it isn't defined by the eye of the beholder. What "worthwhile" software have you written that very few people in the industry can write? I bet you all the stuff you wrote, any mediocre software engineer can write. Which illustrates my point. >What is the "easiest" discipline is a nonsensical question to me. Of course it's nonsensical to you. How convenient. Because answering this question would defeat your argument or display how much knowledge you lack for other forms of engineering. The answer is: "software engineering" It's like refusing to answer the question which is harder: Calculus or algebra? Well they are two different subjects and I am a logical automaton I can't determine which is harder so I am labeling the question as nonsensical even though the entire face of the earth OBVIOUSLY knows calculus is harder. Well guess what you're not a robot. Don't hide behind that as an excuse. Calculus is harder than algebra just like how software engineering is the easiest engineering discipline out there. Even "worthwhile" software that you write is easy.

gilbetron 5y ago
Calculus and algebra were easy. I know you haven't written worthwhile software (yet), since you say writing software is easy. Write something worthwhile and then come back and let me know how easy it was. Although, to be fair, some worthwhile software is easy to write, it's just figuring out what to write is really hard ... but that's one of the reasons why the discipline is hard!
- deltaonefour 5y ago
  >I know you haven't written worthwhile software (yet), since you say writing software is easy. lol. You're a genius. I've stated this multiple times. Software engineering is EASIER than other forms of engineering. This is a bit different than just being "easy" and while I've used the word "easy" you know my intent. I am also absolutely positive all the worthwhile software you have or yet to have written, any mediocre software engineer can do. Just name all the stuff you done. Anyone can do it. Let's look at your stuff: https://github.com/gilbitron https://github.com/gilbitron This is you right? Well when I think of impressive "worthwhile" software I think in terms of kernels, 3D rendering engines, a compiler that kind of thing. Those are things I would argue that actually promote your argument as less software engineers know how to program this stuff. But looking at that site looks like you mostly do typical generic webdev stuff. Web dev is one of the easiest areas of software engineering. Also you're a vue guy and php. Vuejs is the typical choice for old school web dev guys who do php. I assure you all the stuff you built, anyone can do it. Doesn't even come close to "worthwhile." Because anyone can do it, that is why it's easy. You can call it hard. But that's fine it just becomes a word game. Let me put it this way, ALL the software you have done may be "hard" but it's easy enough that any mediocre software engineer out of bootcamp can implement everything you wrote from scratch. >Calculus and algebra were easy. Nowhere near as easy as programming. The math involved with engineering goes much deeper than highschool algebra and calculus. I know you haven't done anything worthwhile in engineering besides webdev because you called it easy.
  - gilbetron 5y ago
    > And that is why software is easy. > That's why it's easy. > Software engineering is a shot in the dark and therefore easy. > Software engineering as it stands is easy. > Nobody in this area of software truly knows what they are doing. Hence why it's easy. > Let me be clear about what I mean by easy. Easy means anyone can do it. If a lot of hardwork and problem solving effort is involved... it doesn't matter and it's still easy because anyone can do it. Seems like you think it is easy. And no, that's not me that you linked. Although I have done webdev work in my career, and only easy webdev work is easy. There is plenty that is difficult in webdev. Also I've created a 3D renderer from scratch (a complete 3D engine, in fact, including networking), a flight simulator, an ISAR simulator, software for force feedback, and a genetic samples assembler - and that's just the stuff from before stack overflow existed.