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> Graphics card - Can this be made upgradable in the future? Would seriously consider building one for gaming if they were. Oh man if they found a way to have

> Graphics card - Can this be made upgradable in the future? Would seriously consider building one for gaming if they were. Oh man if they found a way to have upgradable GPU on a laptop it would be next level! I think it can be done through M.2 slot (the reason why you can get M.2 to PCIe adapters is because M.2 provides a PCIe interface [1], some eGPU solutions use M.2 [2], IIRC it's just a 4 lanes connection through the M.2 connector but better than nothing) - so in order to make this possible on a laptop you would basically have to take small (mobile class) GPUs and solder them on a board that can be inserted in an M.2 slot... I think this is not rocket science but probably those GPUs would be expensive unless the concept really takes off and they are mass produced. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M.2 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M.2 [2] https://linustechtips.com/topic/831808-m2-x4-egpu-dock-fastest-external-laptop-gpu/ https://linustechtips.com/topic/831808-m2-x4-egpu-dock-faste... EDIT - I just remembered that in the past there were some gaming laptops with upgradeable GPU, I think they were made maybe by Asus? And if I remember correctly it was a proprietary connector (but I might be wrong) EDIT 2 - yes I was thinking about MXM and it was not proprietary, thank you to those who pointed that out https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mobile_PCI_Express_Module https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mobile_PCI_Express_Module EDIT 3 - my proposed idea didn't take cooling into consideration, as correctly pointed out in the comments.

rg111 5y ago
I will buy a Framework laptop in a heartbeat if they came with RTX GPUs. It would be doubly great if the GPU were upgradable as you say.
jamesfmilne 5y ago
These GPUs use an MXM connector, not M.2. I've got an HP Z2 Mini unit which also uses MXM for its GPU, and is upgradable. Due to the cooling requirements of a GPU, MXM modules are often pretty thick though, so would probably make the whole laptop thicker. You also have to consider how the heatsink & heatpipes for a GPU would attach to the GPU. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mobile_PCI_Express_Module https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mobile_PCI_Express_Module
Anonymous4272 5y ago
It was dells area 51m recently. I own one, and it was marketed as upgradeable, though it turns out its only upgradable in the same class e.g. mine can only be swapped with a 2060 2070 or 2080.
justsomehnguy 5y ago
> were some gaming laptops with upgradeable GPU You are thinking about MXM [0] Idea was neat but Regular Joe doesn't upgrade GPU in the laptop. And Non-regular Joes who does demand what it should be cheap and performant. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mobile_PCI_Express_Module https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mobile_PCI_Express_Module
jazzyjackson 5y ago
Would you settle for an external eGPU over USBC?
- k1rcher 5y ago
  This is what I have been looking into for a portable gaming setup. My framework setup already has so much raw power in terms of RAM and CPU. A solid GPU is the next step :-) Would do a GPU pass through setup with virtio/QEMU and a Linux host… if only eGPU setups weren’t so damned expensive! And that’s not even factoring in the sheer lack of availability of 30x series cards.
  - tvararu 5y ago
    I have a custom built small form factor PC in a Dan Case A4 [0]. The case is a lot smaller than a Razer Core. And it's a whole PC, not just a GPU. Fits in a cabin bag or backpack and I have traveled with it. You can go even smaller at 3.9L in a Velka 3 [1], if you use a single fan graphics card. - [0] https://www.dan-cases.com/dana4.php https://www.dan-cases.com/dana4.php - [1] https://www.velkase.com/products/velka-3 https://www.velkase.com/products/velka-3
    - k1rcher 5y ago
      The Dan Case is absolutely gorgeous. What hardware are you running in yours? I’d love to get a setup like this going with a 30x series card, but I’m not sure how difficult getting one at listing price is these days.
      - tvararu 5y ago
        No chance buying a GPU at listing price today. Buyer beware: for the Dan Case, it's only compatible with 2.25 slot (45mm) width cards at max. Most 3080s are 2.5 slot (50mm) wide. The EVGA 3080 XC3 Black is a notable exception, and is a very satisfying tight fit [0]. There's also a 3D printed GPU spacer to increase width of the case (sacrificing portability) [1]. Here's my hardware: CASE: Dan A4-SFX v4.1 7L PSU: Corsair SF750 CPU: AMD Ryzen 5 3600XT 6C/12T 3.8GHz/4.5GHz FANS: Asetek 645LT 92mm AIO + Noctua NF-A9x14 x2 MOTHERBOARD: Asus ROG STRIX B550-I GAMING mini-ITX LAN: Intel I225-V 2.5Gb Ethernet WLAN: Intel Wi-Fi 6 AX200 AUDIO: Realtek S1220A RAM: Corsair Vengeance LPX 64GB DDR4 @ 3600MHz GPU: Powercolor AMD Radeon RX 5700 XT Red Dragon NVME0: Sabrent Rocket 1TB R/W 3400/3000 NVME1: Crucial P1 1TB R/W 2000/1700 SSD0: SanDisk Ultra II 1TB R/W 540/500 - [0] https://www.reddit.com/r/sffpc/comments/jhrnob/evga_xc3_3080_black_in_the_dan_a4_v41/ https://www.reddit.com/r/sffpc/comments/jhrnob/evga_xc3_3080... - [1] https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:2771844 https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:2771844
Kletiomdm 5y ago
Just use an external GPU? Or make it upgradeable like an external GPU. Using a mobile GPU chip and putting it into a small external GPU case could be easy. The only reason why current external GPU cases are so big is that the form factor of GPUs is big and the big power consumption. Using a mobile GPU could make this into a small cube of 15*15 or so.
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]
yread 5y ago
The Schenker vision 14 comes with 3050ti and it is pretty repairable
pjmlp 5y ago
They did in the past made laptops with upgradable GPU, I have one Asus that still is working (from 2009). However so few people ever bothered to upgrade them, hence why OEMs have moved on. Even on desktops, every time I came around to upgrade components back in the day, it was about time to upgrade everything.
- spicybright 5y ago
  That's my experience too. Honestly I don't think people are going to upgrade their Framework laptops much. And while they're popular now, it's still likely they'll stop producing parts (assuming the standard for each component isn't completely free to copy). Then you're out of luck. But the real huge win is replacing broken components easily. That alone is making the Framework extremely tempting for me.
alkonaut 5y ago
Upgrading a GPU internally in a laptop chassis is tricky because you need the power/heat/space to work for the range of possible products. And I like a CPU where you might design for a 35W CPU and that gives you dozens of options from 15W to 35W, the GPU range needs to encompass 100W (!) if the purpose is meant to allow configuring as a gaming machine. This will obviously affect cooling/power supply/bulk for all who buy the laptop and don’t want the gaming config. External GPUs have their own difficulties but I think it’s a less challenging design problem than “configurable GPUs [up to enthusiast/gaming/pro cards]”
pmontra 5y ago
My HP ZBook from 2014 has upgradable CPU and GPU. I guess that after a few years the problem would be to find a new part that fits into the slots or somebody selling an old compatible one at a reasonable price.

rg111 5y ago

I will buy a Framework laptop in a heartbeat if they came with RTX GPUs. It would be doubly great if the GPU were upgradable as you say.

jamesfmilne 5y ago

These GPUs use an MXM connector, not M.2. I've got an HP Z2 Mini unit which also uses MXM for its GPU, and is upgradable. Due to the cooling requirements of a GPU, MXM modules are often pretty thick though, so would probably make the whole laptop thicker. You also have to consider how the heatsink & heatpipes for a GPU would attach to the GPU. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mobile_PCI_Express_Module https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mobile_PCI_Express_Module

Anonymous4272 5y ago

It was dells area 51m recently. I own one, and it was marketed as upgradeable, though it turns out its only upgradable in the same class e.g. mine can only be swapped with a 2060 2070 or 2080.

justsomehnguy 5y ago

> were some gaming laptops with upgradeable GPU You are thinking about MXM [0] Idea was neat but Regular Joe doesn't upgrade GPU in the laptop. And Non-regular Joes who does demand what it should be cheap and performant. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mobile_PCI_Express_Module https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mobile_PCI_Express_Module

jazzyjackson 5y ago

Would you settle for an external eGPU over USBC?

k1rcher 5y ago
This is what I have been looking into for a portable gaming setup. My framework setup already has so much raw power in terms of RAM and CPU. A solid GPU is the next step :-) Would do a GPU pass through setup with virtio/QEMU and a Linux host… if only eGPU setups weren’t so damned expensive! And that’s not even factoring in the sheer lack of availability of 30x series cards.
- tvararu 5y ago
  I have a custom built small form factor PC in a Dan Case A4 [0]. The case is a lot smaller than a Razer Core. And it's a whole PC, not just a GPU. Fits in a cabin bag or backpack and I have traveled with it. You can go even smaller at 3.9L in a Velka 3 [1], if you use a single fan graphics card. - [0] https://www.dan-cases.com/dana4.php https://www.dan-cases.com/dana4.php - [1] https://www.velkase.com/products/velka-3 https://www.velkase.com/products/velka-3
  - k1rcher 5y ago
    The Dan Case is absolutely gorgeous. What hardware are you running in yours? I’d love to get a setup like this going with a 30x series card, but I’m not sure how difficult getting one at listing price is these days.
    - tvararu 5y ago
      No chance buying a GPU at listing price today. Buyer beware: for the Dan Case, it's only compatible with 2.25 slot (45mm) width cards at max. Most 3080s are 2.5 slot (50mm) wide. The EVGA 3080 XC3 Black is a notable exception, and is a very satisfying tight fit [0]. There's also a 3D printed GPU spacer to increase width of the case (sacrificing portability) [1]. Here's my hardware: CASE: Dan A4-SFX v4.1 7L PSU: Corsair SF750 CPU: AMD Ryzen 5 3600XT 6C/12T 3.8GHz/4.5GHz FANS: Asetek 645LT 92mm AIO + Noctua NF-A9x14 x2 MOTHERBOARD: Asus ROG STRIX B550-I GAMING mini-ITX LAN: Intel I225-V 2.5Gb Ethernet WLAN: Intel Wi-Fi 6 AX200 AUDIO: Realtek S1220A RAM: Corsair Vengeance LPX 64GB DDR4 @ 3600MHz GPU: Powercolor AMD Radeon RX 5700 XT Red Dragon NVME0: Sabrent Rocket 1TB R/W 3400/3000 NVME1: Crucial P1 1TB R/W 2000/1700 SSD0: SanDisk Ultra II 1TB R/W 540/500 - [0] https://www.reddit.com/r/sffpc/comments/jhrnob/evga_xc3_3080_black_in_the_dan_a4_v41/ https://www.reddit.com/r/sffpc/comments/jhrnob/evga_xc3_3080... - [1] https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:2771844 https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:2771844

Kletiomdm 5y ago

Just use an external GPU? Or make it upgradeable like an external GPU. Using a mobile GPU chip and putting it into a small external GPU case could be easy. The only reason why current external GPU cases are so big is that the form factor of GPUs is big and the big power consumption. Using a mobile GPU could make this into a small cube of 15*15 or so.

deleted 5y ago
[deleted]

yread 5y ago

The Schenker vision 14 comes with 3050ti and it is pretty repairable

pjmlp 5y ago

They did in the past made laptops with upgradable GPU, I have one Asus that still is working (from 2009). However so few people ever bothered to upgrade them, hence why OEMs have moved on. Even on desktops, every time I came around to upgrade components back in the day, it was about time to upgrade everything.

spicybright 5y ago
That's my experience too. Honestly I don't think people are going to upgrade their Framework laptops much. And while they're popular now, it's still likely they'll stop producing parts (assuming the standard for each component isn't completely free to copy). Then you're out of luck. But the real huge win is replacing broken components easily. That alone is making the Framework extremely tempting for me.

alkonaut 5y ago

Upgrading a GPU internally in a laptop chassis is tricky because you need the power/heat/space to work for the range of possible products. And I like a CPU where you might design for a 35W CPU and that gives you dozens of options from 15W to 35W, the GPU range needs to encompass 100W (!) if the purpose is meant to allow configuring as a gaming machine. This will obviously affect cooling/power supply/bulk for all who buy the laptop and don’t want the gaming config. External GPUs have their own difficulties but I think it’s a less challenging design problem than “configurable GPUs [up to enthusiast/gaming/pro cards]”

pmontra 5y ago

My HP ZBook from 2014 has upgradable CPU and GPU. I guess that after a few years the problem would be to find a new part that fits into the slots or somebody selling an old compatible one at a reasonable price.