4 ms·

Repost of something I wrote the other day that I think is relevant: My very average house today is a huge luxury compared to the very average house my grandpar

by learc83 15y ago

Repost of something I wrote the other day that I think is relevant: My very average house today is a huge luxury compared to the very average house my grandparents bought in the 60s. I have a cable bill, an iPhone bill, an internet bill, a netflix bill, and too many various SaaS subscriptions. My grandparents had none of those. I also have a much higher power bill to pay for all my consumer electronics and air conditioning, a higher health insurance bill to pay for drastically better health care, an extra car insurance policy. That's in addition to all the extra stuff I have lying around. 2 cars, not one, both of which are vastly superior and more expensive than what my grandparents had. Superior home appliances. And 1 metric tonne of electronics. I have so much more material wealth than all but the very richest did just 50 years ago. How could I complain that I'm not better off?

forensic 15y ago
You ARE better off. But you are also in the top 20%. The bottom 80% are not as lucky as you. The bottom 80% cannot afford 2 cars, or a house, or cable, or an iPhone, etc. Have some fucking perspective. You are doing well; but look around you. The rest of the country is NOT. A tremendous part of the economy is out of work and cannot even afford to go to the doctor. You're living in a bubble.
- learc83 15y ago
  I'm firmly in the middle in terms of household income. I was comparing myself to the middle income earner from 2 generations ago. My point is that the vast majority of Americans have more material wealth than their equivalents did 50 years ago. Everyone has more., Also Cable penetration is close to 60% in America, so at least half of the bottom 80% can afford it.
  - william42 15y ago
    Cable penetration should also be added to satellite penetration, since both serve (almost) the same purpose.
illumin8 15y ago
You wrongly equate material possessions with happiness. I'd easily go back to a 60s quality lifestyle if my wife didn't have to work and I only had to work 40 hours a week to own a nice house. In the 60s they had most of the same electric appliances that we have today, save the microwave oven, personal computer, and the cellphone. I'd bet that eating food that can't be heated in a microwave is probably more healthy for you. Losing the PC would be a real loss, especially the Internet. Losing the cellphone is probably worth it, since we'd have landlines and can still call anyone we need to. You say we have all of these great things, but most of them are not important to living a quality life. Having time to spend with your family without having to have two wage earners working 60-70 hour weeks is worth more than a flat screen TV and a second car will ever be.
- learc83 15y ago
  Why don't you go back to a 60s lifestyle? It is definitely possible; plenty of people live low impact non material focussed lives. My point is that there is a reason that it takes 2 incomes to support a household now--All the extra stuff we have. I was refuting the people who keep asking why we have to work so hard just to have a normal life.
  - forensic 15y ago
    >All the extra stuff we have. It's NOT that stuff though. That stuff is cheap. It's rent, food, childcare, healthcare, and education. These are not luxuries. Cellphones cost nothing compared to these real costs, which can't be reduced by a "low impact" life.
    - learc83 15y ago
      Food - I read a report recently that said the amount of hours the average person has to work to feed himself has dropped dramatically over the last 100 years. Rent - accept 60s level housing and you can easily afford it, 1 bathroom each kid doesn't get his own bedroom etc.. Childcare - not applicable if you are living a 60s lifestyle you're wife won't work. Education - Expensive b/c the govt subsidizes it. Healthcare - problematic, but only b/c healthcare now is so much better than healthcare then.

by learc83 15y ago

forensic 15y ago

You ARE better off. But you are also in the top 20%. The bottom 80% are not as lucky as you. The bottom 80% cannot afford 2 cars, or a house, or cable, or an iPhone, etc. Have some fucking perspective. You are doing well; but look around you. The rest of the country is NOT. A tremendous part of the economy is out of work and cannot even afford to go to the doctor. You're living in a bubble.

learc83 15y ago
I'm firmly in the middle in terms of household income. I was comparing myself to the middle income earner from 2 generations ago. My point is that the vast majority of Americans have more material wealth than their equivalents did 50 years ago. Everyone has more., Also Cable penetration is close to 60% in America, so at least half of the bottom 80% can afford it.
- william42 15y ago
  Cable penetration should also be added to satellite penetration, since both serve (almost) the same purpose.

illumin8 15y ago

You wrongly equate material possessions with happiness. I'd easily go back to a 60s quality lifestyle if my wife didn't have to work and I only had to work 40 hours a week to own a nice house. In the 60s they had most of the same electric appliances that we have today, save the microwave oven, personal computer, and the cellphone. I'd bet that eating food that can't be heated in a microwave is probably more healthy for you. Losing the PC would be a real loss, especially the Internet. Losing the cellphone is probably worth it, since we'd have landlines and can still call anyone we need to. You say we have all of these great things, but most of them are not important to living a quality life. Having time to spend with your family without having to have two wage earners working 60-70 hour weeks is worth more than a flat screen TV and a second car will ever be.

learc83 15y ago
Why don't you go back to a 60s lifestyle? It is definitely possible; plenty of people live low impact non material focussed lives. My point is that there is a reason that it takes 2 incomes to support a household now--All the extra stuff we have. I was refuting the people who keep asking why we have to work so hard just to have a normal life.
- forensic 15y ago
  >All the extra stuff we have. It's NOT that stuff though. That stuff is cheap. It's rent, food, childcare, healthcare, and education. These are not luxuries. Cellphones cost nothing compared to these real costs, which can't be reduced by a "low impact" life.
  - learc83 15y ago
    Food - I read a report recently that said the amount of hours the average person has to work to feed himself has dropped dramatically over the last 100 years. Rent - accept 60s level housing and you can easily afford it, 1 bathroom each kid doesn't get his own bedroom etc.. Childcare - not applicable if you are living a 60s lifestyle you're wife won't work. Education - Expensive b/c the govt subsidizes it. Healthcare - problematic, but only b/c healthcare now is so much better than healthcare then.