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> and want to help you out in finding the best (non-touristic) spots. Not attacking you but what does "non-touristic" even mean though? If you wanna not be a t

> and want to help you out in finding the best (non-touristic) spots. Not attacking you but what does "non-touristic" even mean though? If you wanna not be a tourist and "live like the locals" get a job and an apartment there and stay a while. If you are only there for a week you'll always be a tourist living like a tourist--you are a transient visitor and nothing more. In my book, to not be a tourist and "live like a local" you'll need to immerse yourself in all the mundane, routine things people in that area do like: - Get a drivers license & register your car (if you have one) - Get a haircut - Go to the doctors office and the dentist - Purchase a new pair of shoes - Take your pet to the dentist - Have a meaningful opinion on some local political issue (I'd say vote, but that isn't always possible without actually being a citizen) - Go grocery shopping and purchase household sundries like toilet paper, paper towels, cleaning spray, brooms, etc. - Get mail and packages delivered to your residence - Speak to people in the native language. Be able to read it too. I dunno. I've traveled more than the average person and I kinda think trying to "experience things like a local" just isn't possible or even desirable. You are a visitor. Embrace it. Only by moving there and living the mundane parts of life can you truly "live like a local". That being said, I do understand the desire to escape the "tourist traps" and go somewhere that isn't just trinket shops and tacky shirts. I don't know if you need to know locals to find that stuff, I think you need to have an understanding of the kinds of things you like to see.

bnralt 5y ago
I agree. I'll add that I've known plenty of people who have done all the things you listed, and still aren't seen as a local, and are treated as more of a prop. This isn't just true of Americans going to other countries, but of people from other countries coming to America as well.
zerkten 5y ago
To me it means "being a better visitor" and "providing a better visit". The idea of living like a local is very extreme and not what I think the person that you replied to was really suggesting. The use of the term "non-touristic" is pretty common amongst non-native speakers, but it means a lot of different things. I would only include a few of your bullets, begrudgingly, as things that I'd put in the "non-touristic" box. For example, someone if someone is trying to select a restaurant, then highlighting the more authentic options which resonate are something that I've had locals do on virtually every trip. Local people to me sometimes includes other business owners or tour guides I've encountered on the trip. I've normally done some research to find the the better spots, but a local person may know which one offers a particular delicacy that is prepared in a traditional way. They may even just know which one doesn't really require reservations. As an example, I was in Kyoto in 2019 with my wife. For various reasons we got to our ryokan (guesthouse) later than expected. We were on the fence about planning a fancy Kaiseki meal later in the week for my birthday because only one of us is an adventurous eater. Our hosts asked us about our plans for the week, if we had food, etc., and suggested an amazing local place that we would never have found on our own. In a way it was intimidating given that no one spoke English, but our hosts had really greased the wheels with the husband and wife who ran the place. This is absolutely not the kind of setup and assistance that you get from a concierge in hotels where there is a degree of risk avoidance. The mundane is only something you have time for on an extended trip. By the very nature of being long enough on a trip that your hair grows out, you'll likely need a trim. You may have the choice of somewhere that's easy and comfortable for a someone from a different place, or you may see that your comfort with the location has changed to open different possibilities. Of course, if you like to throw yourself into situations you can skip the haircut before leaving and try to find something when you arrive. Your personality impacts how comfortable you feel with that.
- mikepurvis 5y ago
  I was in Seoul for a conference a few years ago, and it was pretty obvious that there was a "tourist halo" around the Conrad and other big western hotels. Once you got outside that, you very quickly started to find eateries where they don't accept western credit cards, there's no English on the menu, and there might not even be a person on staff capable of speaking competent English. But like, the small group I was with ended up at a place like this that did Korean BBQ: we showed the proprietor the cash we had, and basically they brought out a selection of delicious things, took our money, and that was that. I guess it's possible we might have been disappointed, but it ended up being a great experience, and certainly far more true to the experience of a local than eating in one of the hotel restaurants.
latchkey 5y ago
You're totally right! When I moved from the Bay Area to Saigon (first time living outside of the US), all of those things really were a fun challenge. The last one though is not so easy... Vietnamese is a painful language to learn beyond just simple things. Especially if you're tone deaf like I am.
hyperhopper 5y ago
Yeah but there is a middle ground. There is the fun local bar that's hidden on a back street, not the generic bar that most visitors are going to because it's recommended by everyone. There are the beaches that locals party at or are empty, not the overcrowded ones that tour busses shuttle people to. You can be a tourist and still get to experience the fun parts of life the way locals do, without having to get a 9-5 in the town.
koonsolo 5y ago
Non-touristic doesn't mean you have to live like a local. Let me give you an example. When we were traveling in Cuba, we met a fellow Flemisch guy, who seemed to know a lot of locals. We started talking. He was there visiting his ex-wifes Cuban family. He and his ex-brother in law invited us for dinner at their house in Santiago de Cuba. One of the best experiences I had, and I don't consider such a thing "touristic". You're not talking to a tour guide there. A lot of times, the locals are very happy to interact with you. And coming from a western country, it always surprised me how welcoming other, poorer countries are.

bnralt 5y ago

I agree. I'll add that I've known plenty of people who have done all the things you listed, and still aren't seen as a local, and are treated as more of a prop. This isn't just true of Americans going to other countries, but of people from other countries coming to America as well.

zerkten 5y ago

To me it means "being a better visitor" and "providing a better visit". The idea of living like a local is very extreme and not what I think the person that you replied to was really suggesting. The use of the term "non-touristic" is pretty common amongst non-native speakers, but it means a lot of different things. I would only include a few of your bullets, begrudgingly, as things that I'd put in the "non-touristic" box. For example, someone if someone is trying to select a restaurant, then highlighting the more authentic options which resonate are something that I've had locals do on virtually every trip. Local people to me sometimes includes other business owners or tour guides I've encountered on the trip. I've normally done some research to find the the better spots, but a local person may know which one offers a particular delicacy that is prepared in a traditional way. They may even just know which one doesn't really require reservations. As an example, I was in Kyoto in 2019 with my wife. For various reasons we got to our ryokan (guesthouse) later than expected. We were on the fence about planning a fancy Kaiseki meal later in the week for my birthday because only one of us is an adventurous eater. Our hosts asked us about our plans for the week, if we had food, etc., and suggested an amazing local place that we would never have found on our own. In a way it was intimidating given that no one spoke English, but our hosts had really greased the wheels with the husband and wife who ran the place. This is absolutely not the kind of setup and assistance that you get from a concierge in hotels where there is a degree of risk avoidance. The mundane is only something you have time for on an extended trip. By the very nature of being long enough on a trip that your hair grows out, you'll likely need a trim. You may have the choice of somewhere that's easy and comfortable for a someone from a different place, or you may see that your comfort with the location has changed to open different possibilities. Of course, if you like to throw yourself into situations you can skip the haircut before leaving and try to find something when you arrive. Your personality impacts how comfortable you feel with that.

mikepurvis 5y ago
I was in Seoul for a conference a few years ago, and it was pretty obvious that there was a "tourist halo" around the Conrad and other big western hotels. Once you got outside that, you very quickly started to find eateries where they don't accept western credit cards, there's no English on the menu, and there might not even be a person on staff capable of speaking competent English. But like, the small group I was with ended up at a place like this that did Korean BBQ: we showed the proprietor the cash we had, and basically they brought out a selection of delicious things, took our money, and that was that. I guess it's possible we might have been disappointed, but it ended up being a great experience, and certainly far more true to the experience of a local than eating in one of the hotel restaurants.

latchkey 5y ago

You're totally right! When I moved from the Bay Area to Saigon (first time living outside of the US), all of those things really were a fun challenge. The last one though is not so easy... Vietnamese is a painful language to learn beyond just simple things. Especially if you're tone deaf like I am.

hyperhopper 5y ago

Yeah but there is a middle ground. There is the fun local bar that's hidden on a back street, not the generic bar that most visitors are going to because it's recommended by everyone. There are the beaches that locals party at or are empty, not the overcrowded ones that tour busses shuttle people to. You can be a tourist and still get to experience the fun parts of life the way locals do, without having to get a 9-5 in the town.

koonsolo 5y ago

Non-touristic doesn't mean you have to live like a local. Let me give you an example. When we were traveling in Cuba, we met a fellow Flemisch guy, who seemed to know a lot of locals. We started talking. He was there visiting his ex-wifes Cuban family. He and his ex-brother in law invited us for dinner at their house in Santiago de Cuba. One of the best experiences I had, and I don't consider such a thing "touristic". You're not talking to a tour guide there. A lot of times, the locals are very happy to interact with you. And coming from a western country, it always surprised me how welcoming other, poorer countries are.