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Sending fraudulent people to jail for a long, long time is fundamental to running a healthy society. One of the reasons the US is a decent place to live compare

Sending fraudulent people to jail for a long, long time is fundamental to running a healthy society. One of the reasons the US is a decent place to live compared to other countries is because we actually prosecute frauds and criminals here. Let's start seeing some other countries around the world start doing this, like India, Russia, and China. My 80 year old mother was recently tricked into wiring money by Indian scammers threatening her. I'm really sick of this shit.

user_7832 5y ago
> One of the reasons the US is a decent place to live compared to other countries is because we actually prosecute frauds and criminals here. Let's start seeing some other countries around the world start doing this, like India, Russia, and China. I'm really not sure fraud is the biggest issue plaguing these countries... corruption is definitely an issue (though the US has in some cases legalized it into lobbying and PACs and the like). It's great that people doing scummy things are held accountable, but are the Sa cklers of Purdue P harma in prison? They've (unarguably) hurt and killed way more than Holmes did, but where's justice for that?
- shoulderfake 5y ago
  How many wall st honchos went to jail for the subprime mortgage crash ?
- refurb 5y ago
  Nobody said the US system was perfect, just better (along with other developed countries that have rule of law). I lived in a developing country for a while and the corruption can be maddening. You might agree to partner with someone to buy property, they take your money and cut you out. In corrupt countries, you might be entirely screwed - that person has too many connections and influence, nobody will touch them. At least in countries with rule of law you could sue them. You might not win or be made whole, but at least there is a system that is somewhat dependable.
  - user_7832 5y ago
    I agree, but also disagree. Look at the entire Epstein (and co.) trials - the rich and well connected are thoroughly protected across the world. Yes, it's more likely that you can hold people accountable but only to an extent. (Fwiw I'm from India so I'm familiar with the system, and I fully agree it's far from perfect)
    - refurb 5y ago
      How do you know the rich and well connect were protected? Do you know that other prosecutions aren't being planned?
niyazpk 5y ago
> Sending fraudulent people to jail for a long, long time is fundamental to running a healthy society Really?! Interesting... I agree, a functioning society needs good law and order, and some way to prosecute and bring criminals to justice. But I am personally not convinced that sending someone "to jail for a long, long time" is the solution. How is that productive? I think we need to come up with better ways to serve justice than physically restricting otherwise smart or productive individuals to a room for decades on end. As soon as we are done with abolishing the death penalty, I would want us to start looking at abolishing this "decades long locking up" of folks. I don't have a good solution as I said, but I am convinced that this is not it.
- beebmam 5y ago
  The point of sending them to jail for a long, long time is to protect society from them. Honest people don't deserve to live in a society filled with liars and cheats and conmen. Send them straight to hell
- seibelj 5y ago
  The length can be debated, but jail wastes the most priceless resource you have - time. That’s why it’s a punishment.
  - taeric 5y ago
    I think the question is whether punitive policies work in that way. I'm fairly comfortable saying this person getting locked up for a long time will probably not deter too many others from doing similar, at a personal level. I suppose it can be argued that it doesn't have to act as a deterrent to individuals at a high rate, but to groups? But... why aren't we then hearing about everyone else that enabled this? (That is, this just encourages more folks to make sure to have a scape goat.) Or, do we really think it was down to just this one person's actions?
- yCombLinks 5y ago
  It's net productive because it removes the large negative productivity from fraud / other crimes from society.
nr2x 5y ago
We pick a sacrificial lamb once a decade to give the appearance of enforcement without addressing root causes. See - 90s: Enron; 00s: Madoff; 10s: Holmes
ipiz0618 5y ago
Are you sure you want standards like Russia or China? The definition of "fraudulent people" there might just be...different

user_7832 5y ago

> One of the reasons the US is a decent place to live compared to other countries is because we actually prosecute frauds and criminals here. Let's start seeing some other countries around the world start doing this, like India, Russia, and China. I'm really not sure fraud is the biggest issue plaguing these countries... corruption is definitely an issue (though the US has in some cases legalized it into lobbying and PACs and the like). It's great that people doing scummy things are held accountable, but are the Sa cklers of Purdue P harma in prison? They've (unarguably) hurt and killed way more than Holmes did, but where's justice for that?

shoulderfake 5y ago
How many wall st honchos went to jail for the subprime mortgage crash ?
refurb 5y ago
Nobody said the US system was perfect, just better (along with other developed countries that have rule of law). I lived in a developing country for a while and the corruption can be maddening. You might agree to partner with someone to buy property, they take your money and cut you out. In corrupt countries, you might be entirely screwed - that person has too many connections and influence, nobody will touch them. At least in countries with rule of law you could sue them. You might not win or be made whole, but at least there is a system that is somewhat dependable.
- user_7832 5y ago
  I agree, but also disagree. Look at the entire Epstein (and co.) trials - the rich and well connected are thoroughly protected across the world. Yes, it's more likely that you can hold people accountable but only to an extent. (Fwiw I'm from India so I'm familiar with the system, and I fully agree it's far from perfect)
  - refurb 5y ago
    How do you know the rich and well connect were protected? Do you know that other prosecutions aren't being planned?

niyazpk 5y ago

> Sending fraudulent people to jail for a long, long time is fundamental to running a healthy society Really?! Interesting... I agree, a functioning society needs good law and order, and some way to prosecute and bring criminals to justice. But I am personally not convinced that sending someone "to jail for a long, long time" is the solution. How is that productive? I think we need to come up with better ways to serve justice than physically restricting otherwise smart or productive individuals to a room for decades on end. As soon as we are done with abolishing the death penalty, I would want us to start looking at abolishing this "decades long locking up" of folks. I don't have a good solution as I said, but I am convinced that this is not it.

beebmam 5y ago
The point of sending them to jail for a long, long time is to protect society from them. Honest people don't deserve to live in a society filled with liars and cheats and conmen. Send them straight to hell
seibelj 5y ago
The length can be debated, but jail wastes the most priceless resource you have - time. That’s why it’s a punishment.
- taeric 5y ago
  I think the question is whether punitive policies work in that way. I'm fairly comfortable saying this person getting locked up for a long time will probably not deter too many others from doing similar, at a personal level. I suppose it can be argued that it doesn't have to act as a deterrent to individuals at a high rate, but to groups? But... why aren't we then hearing about everyone else that enabled this? (That is, this just encourages more folks to make sure to have a scape goat.) Or, do we really think it was down to just this one person's actions?
yCombLinks 5y ago
It's net productive because it removes the large negative productivity from fraud / other crimes from society.

nr2x 5y ago

We pick a sacrificial lamb once a decade to give the appearance of enforcement without addressing root causes. See - 90s: Enron; 00s: Madoff; 10s: Holmes

ipiz0618 5y ago

Are you sure you want standards like Russia or China? The definition of "fraudulent people" there might just be...different