3 ms·

Hi all, Peldi here. Thanks for the feedback. I don't know how much vacation everyone here is taking (I could look in the shared vacation calendar we have), but

Hi all, Peldi here. Thanks for the feedback. I don't know how much vacation everyone here is taking (I could look in the shared vacation calendar we have), but I'd say everyone is taking 3-4 weeks a year, plus some more time when they take their laptop to the beach and work half-days from there. This is one of the policies that I fear might not work if we ever reach a certain size, but so far we're all happy with it...it's just not something we keep track of for other people, just ourselves. Thanks again for the feedback, it's a big reason why I'm sharing our current policies.

dailyrorschach 15y ago
How does this affect your accounting and total compensation? Is there a standard minimum at all that is paid out?
cHalgan 15y ago
I just want to comment that policy like this will cause you problems in recruiting a certain type of talent. Of course, that will be imposible to measure, but I can tell you none of my friends (we are little older but not so much) will not work for a company which has a policy like that. We just had a beer talk last Friday about that.
- adaml_623 15y ago
  Could you please elaborate on why?
  - cHalgan 15y ago
    Reasoning goes like this: - If a company is really about "we don't care about how much vacation you take", then why not to give me minimum vacations? It seems intellectually dishonest. - How I do know how much of vacation I can take and whether that amount is preventing me of getting raise/bonus/promotion? - This policy means that my vacation will vary depending on manager and current project. I cannot commit to travel with my kids, I cannot commit to visit my parents... because who knows: I might have a different manager next month. - If I take two weeks vacation and none of my teammates are taking vacations, am I going to be fired? Are they going to consider me that I'm not a team player? - I can lose a job after working for year or so without taking any vacation, but if I did accure vacation I will get some money (kinda reward for working hard for a year and not taking vacation), while in case of "flexible vacation" I get nothing.
    - CamperBob 15y ago
      It seems like the one correct answer to the vacation policy question is, "Do what you want, as long as you don't hose the company." If you want to work remotely for the next month and nothing depends on your physical presence at the office, fine. If you want to fuck off for the next month and you're not on anyone's critical path, that's fine, too. Restricting things a bit, "not hosing the company" could be interpreted to mean that you can take off when you want, but for absences longer than x days you need to let your supervisor know y days in advance so s/he can take it into account when necessary. It doesn't sound like this would be an unreasonable thing to ask, as long as x and y are clearly stated by the company and respected by employees. This whole thread reminds me of why I don't work for other people. The idea of someone demanding my physical presence for a portion of each day, for no reason other than the fact that they can, makes me frown and cock my head to the side like a puzzled beagle.
      - randallsquared 15y ago
        If you want to fuck off for the next month and you're not on anyone's critical path, that's fine, too. But if you can do this, maybe they and you will think about whether they need you the month after that, too.
        CamperBob 15y ago
        If you're doing good and valuable work, and the company acknowledges this, you won't want to vanish for weeks or months at a time. The overriding goal is to run an outfit where the employees want to be there. If you do that, then vacation-policy abuse will not be a major problem. If you don't, then vacation-policy abuse is the least of your problems.
reduxredacted 15y ago
Peldi-- I believe you to be correct in your fear. It doesn't scale unless you ensure the managers layers below you encourage their employees to take time off and are as flexible as you. I'd also strongly recommend looking over that shared vacation calendar and identify anyone who may not be taking a reasonable amount of time off. Some people are just love their jobs ... I'm one of them, and it's not as big a deal (though, I believe nearly everyone benefits from some time off, even when forced). But make a point to ensure they don't think the "we don't track vacation time" equates to "we don't take vacation time". I'd also steer clear of the "laptops to the beach" comments. I don't take frequent vacations, but when I do, I need to go places where I can barely get a phone call and have no internet (I fight with myself on this topic every time, but when I go on a cruise or camp in a remote part of the state that I live in, I always return more refreshed than when I go somewhere that I can keep up with e-mail). I don't know the culture of your company, but at my company "laptops on the beach" would be code for "obligation to carry your laptop with you at all times". Just my 2p, you sound like a decent leader and I appreciate the transparency.

dailyrorschach 15y ago

How does this affect your accounting and total compensation? Is there a standard minimum at all that is paid out?

cHalgan 15y ago

I just want to comment that policy like this will cause you problems in recruiting a certain type of talent. Of course, that will be imposible to measure, but I can tell you none of my friends (we are little older but not so much) will not work for a company which has a policy like that. We just had a beer talk last Friday about that.

adaml_623 15y ago
Could you please elaborate on why?
- cHalgan 15y ago
  Reasoning goes like this: - If a company is really about "we don't care about how much vacation you take", then why not to give me minimum vacations? It seems intellectually dishonest. - How I do know how much of vacation I can take and whether that amount is preventing me of getting raise/bonus/promotion? - This policy means that my vacation will vary depending on manager and current project. I cannot commit to travel with my kids, I cannot commit to visit my parents... because who knows: I might have a different manager next month. - If I take two weeks vacation and none of my teammates are taking vacations, am I going to be fired? Are they going to consider me that I'm not a team player? - I can lose a job after working for year or so without taking any vacation, but if I did accure vacation I will get some money (kinda reward for working hard for a year and not taking vacation), while in case of "flexible vacation" I get nothing.
  - CamperBob 15y ago
    It seems like the one correct answer to the vacation policy question is, "Do what you want, as long as you don't hose the company." If you want to work remotely for the next month and nothing depends on your physical presence at the office, fine. If you want to fuck off for the next month and you're not on anyone's critical path, that's fine, too. Restricting things a bit, "not hosing the company" could be interpreted to mean that you can take off when you want, but for absences longer than x days you need to let your supervisor know y days in advance so s/he can take it into account when necessary. It doesn't sound like this would be an unreasonable thing to ask, as long as x and y are clearly stated by the company and respected by employees. This whole thread reminds me of why I don't work for other people. The idea of someone demanding my physical presence for a portion of each day, for no reason other than the fact that they can, makes me frown and cock my head to the side like a puzzled beagle.
    - randallsquared 15y ago
      If you want to fuck off for the next month and you're not on anyone's critical path, that's fine, too. But if you can do this, maybe they and you will think about whether they need you the month after that, too.
      - CamperBob 15y ago
        If you're doing good and valuable work, and the company acknowledges this, you won't want to vanish for weeks or months at a time. The overriding goal is to run an outfit where the employees want to be there. If you do that, then vacation-policy abuse will not be a major problem. If you don't, then vacation-policy abuse is the least of your problems.

reduxredacted 15y ago

Peldi-- I believe you to be correct in your fear. It doesn't scale unless you ensure the managers layers below you encourage their employees to take time off and are as flexible as you. I'd also strongly recommend looking over that shared vacation calendar and identify anyone who may not be taking a reasonable amount of time off. Some people are just love their jobs ... I'm one of them, and it's not as big a deal (though, I believe nearly everyone benefits from some time off, even when forced). But make a point to ensure they don't think the "we don't track vacation time" equates to "we don't take vacation time". I'd also steer clear of the "laptops to the beach" comments. I don't take frequent vacations, but when I do, I need to go places where I can barely get a phone call and have no internet (I fight with myself on this topic every time, but when I go on a cruise or camp in a remote part of the state that I live in, I always return more refreshed than when I go somewhere that I can keep up with e-mail). I don't know the culture of your company, but at my company "laptops on the beach" would be code for "obligation to carry your laptop with you at all times". Just my 2p, you sound like a decent leader and I appreciate the transparency.