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What does it mean to permanently brick the hardware?

emidln 5y ago
Most ECUs have diagnostic messages that can read/write memory. This is often intended to be controlled by what "mode" the ECU is in (manufacturing/engineering/production/dealer-service), but these aren't always well tested or properly implemented controls. Fuzzing these leads to weird behavior and state machines with not-well-tested transitions. Whether you can reset these to a known state is ECU specific, and often will involve knowledge that isn't publicly known.
- jacquesm 5y ago
  And sometimes it will require gear that isn't publicly available.
deleted 5y ago
[deleted]
balls187 5y ago
> What does it mean to permanently brick the hardware? Colloquially means rendering a device in useless state which cannot be recovered. "Bricking" typically occurs when performing some sort of software update that goes awry, such as during powerfailure, using unofficial updates, etc. More and more systems have ways to recover from a bad update, especially when the manufacturer offers OTA updates, but in the case like article where an the ECU is not designed to be updated by end-consumers, a bad flash/update can lead to the device being left useless.
- j4hdufd8 5y ago
  > More and more systems have ways to recover from a bad update, especially when the manufacturer offers OTA updates, but in the case like article where an the ECU is not designed to be updated by end-consumers, a bad flash/update can lead to the device being left useless. and there is no way to obtain the original ROM? and flash it and everything is ok again?
  - balls187 5y ago
    > and there is no way to obtain the original ROM? and flash it and everything is ok again? If it was permanently bricked, then no. The device would be in a state that it could not restart the flash process. If reflashing were possible with the original ROM, it would not be considered permanently bricked. It would be possible that an OEM or advanced specialist may have the ability to salvage a permanently bricked device, through special equipment, and/or repair/replace components. However for all practical purposes, if a (update/patch/hacking) process can leave a device "permanently bricked", an end-user cannot recover from that state.
froh 5y ago
Is a colloquialism for breaking it beyond repair. The origin is that you turn the fancy expensive electronic device into a heavy paperweight like block, just like a brick. For the "how" of what happens inside so it can't be repaired please see the sibling comments.

Most ECUs have diagnostic messages that can read/write memory. This is often intended to be controlled by what "mode" the ECU is in (manufacturing/engineering/production/dealer-service), but these aren't always well tested or properly implemented controls. Fuzzing these leads to weird behavior and state machines with not-well-tested transitions. Whether you can reset these to a known state is ECU specific, and often will involve knowledge that isn't publicly known.

jacquesm 5y ago
And sometimes it will require gear that isn't publicly available.

deleted 5y ago

[deleted]

balls187 5y ago

> What does it mean to permanently brick the hardware? Colloquially means rendering a device in useless state which cannot be recovered. "Bricking" typically occurs when performing some sort of software update that goes awry, such as during powerfailure, using unofficial updates, etc. More and more systems have ways to recover from a bad update, especially when the manufacturer offers OTA updates, but in the case like article where an the ECU is not designed to be updated by end-consumers, a bad flash/update can lead to the device being left useless.

j4hdufd8 5y ago
> More and more systems have ways to recover from a bad update, especially when the manufacturer offers OTA updates, but in the case like article where an the ECU is not designed to be updated by end-consumers, a bad flash/update can lead to the device being left useless. and there is no way to obtain the original ROM? and flash it and everything is ok again?
- balls187 5y ago
  > and there is no way to obtain the original ROM? and flash it and everything is ok again? If it was permanently bricked, then no. The device would be in a state that it could not restart the flash process. If reflashing were possible with the original ROM, it would not be considered permanently bricked. It would be possible that an OEM or advanced specialist may have the ability to salvage a permanently bricked device, through special equipment, and/or repair/replace components. However for all practical purposes, if a (update/patch/hacking) process can leave a device "permanently bricked", an end-user cannot recover from that state.

froh 5y ago

Is a colloquialism for breaking it beyond repair. The origin is that you turn the fancy expensive electronic device into a heavy paperweight like block, just like a brick. For the "how" of what happens inside so it can't be repaired please see the sibling comments.