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My company did the same. It must be a fad among CEOs. While on the face of it this policy looks like an improvement, it turned an entitlement into something t

My company did the same. It must be a fad among CEOs. While on the face of it this policy looks like an improvement, it turned an entitlement into something that depends on the generosity of one's boss. Also, keep in mind that when quitting you don't get any accrued money. I highly dislike it.

dkokelley 15y ago
A few things. First, if the policy really does change from an entitlement to an unspoken privilege granted by your immediate superior, then I doubt the policy was implemented properly. I suppose it depends on the industry, but if corporate policy says your vacations are not tracked, it stands to reason that your time off can't be requested/approved/denied. If you get your work done, your company should by happy with your performance. Also, when you do leave a company, you don't always get the vacation days as a bonus in your paycheck. Sometimes those days just disappear. What's even worse is that some vacation days may be a part of your compensation plan, but work pressures prevent you from using them, and they expire within a year. Vacation days are hardly an entitlement. Personally, my ideal work situation would allow me unlimited and untracked vacation days, absolute freedom to work when, where, and how I choose, and pay me ONLY based on performance (both my direct contributions and a percentage of overall company profits). I suppose this is fairly close to actual business ownership.
- Domenic_S 15y ago
  > when you do leave a company, you don't always get the vacation days as a bonus in your paycheck. Depends on the state. In California, vacation time is earned as it is accrued and thus must be paid out on termination (voluntary or not).
  - dkokelley 15y ago
    Yes the law does mandate vacation payout in some areas, but the actual vacation days also expire, meaning that your employer won't have to pay you for 20 years of accrued vacation. This is why I don't like vacation days as an accrued benefit.
    - mixmastamyk 15y ago
      Not true in California, it may stop accruing, but can never expire. http://www.dir.ca.gov/dlse/faq_vacation.htm http://www.dir.ca.gov/dlse/faq_vacation.htm (See #4).
      - dkokelley 15y ago
        Interesting. I worked at a large bank a while back and they had a use it or lose it policy. Either the law recently changed or they were out of compliance.
        mixmastamyk 15y ago
        I don't think it is a recent change. The reason I am familiar with it is my current employer tried to pull this one--I showed them the law and they backed down thankfully. Also, don't give up on old wages. An employee at a former employer filed a class action lawsuit (somehow I got attached), his hardwork resulted in an $8k check that found its way to my doorstep. ;)
  - bugsy 15y ago
    This is the exact reason why these policies claim there is no specific time. No allocated days legally means zero days. Companies use this "flexible vacation" policy specifically so they don't have to comply with pay out in jurisdictions such as California. It's a big scam, which is why the real question to ask and answer is how many days on average are taken, and if they include "half days" as "vacation time" in the response, they are being intentionally highly misleading. Working half days is NOT vacation. It's work.
    - dkokelley 15y ago
      As stated elsewhere, I doubt the payout liability is that large, considering that most employees only get to keep vacation days for a little over a year before they expire. I disagree with your use of the word scam to describe an untracked vacation policy. An employee at any one point in time will probably have no more than 6 weeks of accrued, unexpired vacation time (assuming they get 3 weeks per year and haven't taken a vacation in 2 years and their vacation rolls over a little bit). This is only 3 pay periods, or just over 10% of their actual pay (6/52 weeks). I would agree that in general vacation policies are a bit of a scam in that you are promised x days as part of your compensation package, but then are told when they can or can't be used, and resist if you try to use them all at once, and expire them if you hold on to them for too long... Come to think of it, defined vacation days are a bit like airline miles.
      - deleted 15y ago
        [deleted]

dkokelley 15y ago

A few things. First, if the policy really does change from an entitlement to an unspoken privilege granted by your immediate superior, then I doubt the policy was implemented properly. I suppose it depends on the industry, but if corporate policy says your vacations are not tracked, it stands to reason that your time off can't be requested/approved/denied. If you get your work done, your company should by happy with your performance. Also, when you do leave a company, you don't always get the vacation days as a bonus in your paycheck. Sometimes those days just disappear. What's even worse is that some vacation days may be a part of your compensation plan, but work pressures prevent you from using them, and they expire within a year. Vacation days are hardly an entitlement. Personally, my ideal work situation would allow me unlimited and untracked vacation days, absolute freedom to work when, where, and how I choose, and pay me ONLY based on performance (both my direct contributions and a percentage of overall company profits). I suppose this is fairly close to actual business ownership.

Domenic_S 15y ago
> when you do leave a company, you don't always get the vacation days as a bonus in your paycheck. Depends on the state. In California, vacation time is earned as it is accrued and thus must be paid out on termination (voluntary or not).
- dkokelley 15y ago
  Yes the law does mandate vacation payout in some areas, but the actual vacation days also expire, meaning that your employer won't have to pay you for 20 years of accrued vacation. This is why I don't like vacation days as an accrued benefit.
  - mixmastamyk 15y ago
    Not true in California, it may stop accruing, but can never expire. http://www.dir.ca.gov/dlse/faq_vacation.htm http://www.dir.ca.gov/dlse/faq_vacation.htm (See #4).
    - dkokelley 15y ago
      Interesting. I worked at a large bank a while back and they had a use it or lose it policy. Either the law recently changed or they were out of compliance.
      - mixmastamyk 15y ago
        I don't think it is a recent change. The reason I am familiar with it is my current employer tried to pull this one--I showed them the law and they backed down thankfully. Also, don't give up on old wages. An employee at a former employer filed a class action lawsuit (somehow I got attached), his hardwork resulted in an $8k check that found its way to my doorstep. ;)
- bugsy 15y ago
  This is the exact reason why these policies claim there is no specific time. No allocated days legally means zero days. Companies use this "flexible vacation" policy specifically so they don't have to comply with pay out in jurisdictions such as California. It's a big scam, which is why the real question to ask and answer is how many days on average are taken, and if they include "half days" as "vacation time" in the response, they are being intentionally highly misleading. Working half days is NOT vacation. It's work.
  - dkokelley 15y ago
    As stated elsewhere, I doubt the payout liability is that large, considering that most employees only get to keep vacation days for a little over a year before they expire. I disagree with your use of the word scam to describe an untracked vacation policy. An employee at any one point in time will probably have no more than 6 weeks of accrued, unexpired vacation time (assuming they get 3 weeks per year and haven't taken a vacation in 2 years and their vacation rolls over a little bit). This is only 3 pay periods, or just over 10% of their actual pay (6/52 weeks). I would agree that in general vacation policies are a bit of a scam in that you are promised x days as part of your compensation package, but then are told when they can or can't be used, and resist if you try to use them all at once, and expire them if you hold on to them for too long... Come to think of it, defined vacation days are a bit like airline miles.
    - deleted 15y ago
      [deleted]