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The breakdown I'd like to see is a histogram of where calories come from, binned by the size of the farm they are grown on. Most farms (and farmland) in the US

The breakdown I'd like to see is a histogram of where calories come from, binned by the size of the farm they are grown on. Most farms (and farmland) in the US are still classified as family farms. As long as they are closely held, farms managing thousands of acres are family farms. https://www.ers.usda.gov/topics/farm-economy/land-use-land-value-tenure/farmland-ownership-and-tenure/ https://www.ers.usda.gov/topics/farm-economy/land-use-land-v... The good news if if you convince an industrial farmer that something will be more profitable, they will do it, at least in aggregate they don't resist better methods for no reason.

jelliclesfarm 5y ago
Family farms operate about half of America’s farmland and they are responsible for about 21% of production. Link: https://www.usda.gov/media/blog/2020/01/23/look-americas-family-farms https://www.usda.gov/media/blog/2020/01/23/look-americas-fam... Family farms grow commodity and fiber and not necessarily food calories. ‘Industrial farmer’ will toe the line of the inputs industry(feed, fertilizer and weedicides) and collect subsidies. Profitability doesn’t relate to good soil practices. Profit is extracted from all that ancillary to the food production industry. Example: There is no money in growing food. The profit comes if you own your truck lines and part of the supply chain. Or Agtech or inputs make more money than the proceeds of actual food. Subsidies make up most farm income and pushing more farmers into debt and bankruptcy. It’s not very rosy. Industrial farms have polluted our waters and poisoned our soils that habitat and eco systems are entirely decimated. And crop diversity is also severely compromised and we lose so much variety and cultivars. That’s why we get tasteless red delicious apples and Roma tomatoes because it’s easy to mechanize to feed billions cheap food. In my opinion, I think there should be two kinds of food. Cheap Soylent kind of nutritious goop to stave off malnutrition and starvation in industrial factory farms with strict protocols to deal with the environmental impact and then real food whose price reflects the true cost of growing food for billions cheaply. But all ag and food production should be termed industrial as it is the erasure of nature and habitat and eco systems. I am very much in favour of the late great E.O.Wilson’s Half Earth proposal and I think it should be considered in earnest to save our planet.
- maxerickson 5y ago
  From your link: Our research found that family farms remain a key part of U.S. agriculture, making up 98% of all farms and providing 88% of production. Most farms are small family farms, and they operate almost half of U.S. farm land, while generating 21% of production. Midsize and large-scale family farms account for about 66% of production; and non-family farms represent the remaining 2.1% of farms and 12% of production. My point was that the use of "family farm" with no additional context (as in the article), is very difficult to interpret. You've linked a description that includes several types of farm under the label "family farm" but elided the "small" that reflects the statistics you quote.
  - jelliclesfarm 5y ago
    I am not sure I understand your point. Please clarify. In the United States, the average size of a farm is around 400 acres.
    - maxerickson 5y ago
      You wrote "Family farms operate about half of America’s farmland and they are responsible for about 21% of production". The resource you link identifies those as small family farms and gives much larger ownership and production numbers when larger farms that are also classified as family farms are included. The article linked for HN discussion uses the term "family farm", which we can see doesn't mean a lot in the US. Now you are discussing, probably, mean size, which the article you link makes clear doesn't mean a lot (because there are many many tiny, not very productive farms).
      - jelliclesfarm 5y ago
        ‘Farms’ can mean a lot of things and they are not all producing food calories. So what is your definition of ‘productivity’? A farm can be profitable not growing anything and collecting subsidies. Many ranchers have a small herd and use their ‘farmland/ranches’ for endangered mitigation purposes as there is a lot of federal dollars for conservation. There are ‘farms’ that have upto $250k/year tax write off for an alpaca farm.

jelliclesfarm 5y ago

Family farms operate about half of America’s farmland and they are responsible for about 21% of production. Link: https://www.usda.gov/media/blog/2020/01/23/look-americas-family-farms https://www.usda.gov/media/blog/2020/01/23/look-americas-fam... Family farms grow commodity and fiber and not necessarily food calories. ‘Industrial farmer’ will toe the line of the inputs industry(feed, fertilizer and weedicides) and collect subsidies. Profitability doesn’t relate to good soil practices. Profit is extracted from all that ancillary to the food production industry. Example: There is no money in growing food. The profit comes if you own your truck lines and part of the supply chain. Or Agtech or inputs make more money than the proceeds of actual food. Subsidies make up most farm income and pushing more farmers into debt and bankruptcy. It’s not very rosy. Industrial farms have polluted our waters and poisoned our soils that habitat and eco systems are entirely decimated. And crop diversity is also severely compromised and we lose so much variety and cultivars. That’s why we get tasteless red delicious apples and Roma tomatoes because it’s easy to mechanize to feed billions cheap food. In my opinion, I think there should be two kinds of food. Cheap Soylent kind of nutritious goop to stave off malnutrition and starvation in industrial factory farms with strict protocols to deal with the environmental impact and then real food whose price reflects the true cost of growing food for billions cheaply. But all ag and food production should be termed industrial as it is the erasure of nature and habitat and eco systems. I am very much in favour of the late great E.O.Wilson’s Half Earth proposal and I think it should be considered in earnest to save our planet.

maxerickson 5y ago
From your link: Our research found that family farms remain a key part of U.S. agriculture, making up 98% of all farms and providing 88% of production. Most farms are small family farms, and they operate almost half of U.S. farm land, while generating 21% of production. Midsize and large-scale family farms account for about 66% of production; and non-family farms represent the remaining 2.1% of farms and 12% of production. My point was that the use of "family farm" with no additional context (as in the article), is very difficult to interpret. You've linked a description that includes several types of farm under the label "family farm" but elided the "small" that reflects the statistics you quote.
- jelliclesfarm 5y ago
  I am not sure I understand your point. Please clarify. In the United States, the average size of a farm is around 400 acres.
  - maxerickson 5y ago
    You wrote "Family farms operate about half of America’s farmland and they are responsible for about 21% of production". The resource you link identifies those as small family farms and gives much larger ownership and production numbers when larger farms that are also classified as family farms are included. The article linked for HN discussion uses the term "family farm", which we can see doesn't mean a lot in the US. Now you are discussing, probably, mean size, which the article you link makes clear doesn't mean a lot (because there are many many tiny, not very productive farms).
    - jelliclesfarm 5y ago
      ‘Farms’ can mean a lot of things and they are not all producing food calories. So what is your definition of ‘productivity’? A farm can be profitable not growing anything and collecting subsidies. Many ranchers have a small herd and use their ‘farmland/ranches’ for endangered mitigation purposes as there is a lot of federal dollars for conservation. There are ‘farms’ that have upto $250k/year tax write off for an alpaca farm.