4 ms·

I've had a few of the things you listed happen, including getting beat up for my race, not getting an apartment rented out because of my weird name, and rejecte

I've had a few of the things you listed happen, including getting beat up for my race, not getting an apartment rented out because of my weird name, and rejected by my mother in law. (I'm an arab by the way, and my wife is chinese). I've also not gotten a job because I was considered "white". The hiring manager was a friend, so he let me in on the "social justice" that was going on behind the scenes. These are both "actual racism" to use your terms, and I revile them equally.

pm90 5y ago
I’m sorry about what happened to you. However, your individual experience to the contrary does not counteract the general point.
- colordrops 5y ago
  And what exactly is the "general point"?
  - garbagecoder 5y ago
    That reverse racism, especially against Asians, is real?
    - dragonwriter 5y ago
      Discrimination against Asians isn't “reverse racism” (to the extent that phrase is ever meaningful), in any sense, unless maybe it's in an environment where Asians historically hold disproportionate social power and have used it to systematically discriminate against non-Asians.
      - garbagecoder 5y ago
        I’m sorry you’re ignorant of history. There used to be laws like “Chinese Exclusion Acts” that were straight up racism based on a theory of racial inferiority of Asians. Now they are being punished for being academically superior in the name of equity, hence the reverse. Though I agree with you the phrase is mostly meaningless, to the extent it has meaning it’s exactly what I’ve described. Which you seem to agree with, so I’m not sure why you’re flaming me.
        dragonwriter 5y ago
        > I’m sorry you’re ignorant of history. I’m...not. > There used to be laws like “Chinese Exclusion Acts” that were straight up racism based on a theory of racial inferiority of Asians. Yes, discrimination against Asians is quite common in US history, so any such current discrimination wouldn't be “reverse racism”.
        garbagecoder 5y ago
        Then what was your point? So, now there is such a thing as reverse racism? I think you just wanted to pick a fight. Be gone. It's reverse racism because they're being punished for their perceived or real superiority as I pointed out. If you can't at least understand that distinction in good faith, you're just arguing for the sake of it.
        Siira 5y ago
        The parent is trying to say that it’s just regular old racism. Competent Asians are disadvantaged because this serves the elite better. I think the reason underperforming minorities are so prioritized by the media and the elites is simply that the elites don’t feel much competitive pressure from them, and using them to distract the masses, they can then conveniently screw the minorities that are actually threatening their interests. Another reason is to delegitimize standardization of merit (e.g., standardized comprehensive exams). This allows them to use a subjective (“holistic”) approach that obviously favors themselves.
ZeroGravitas 5y ago
I'm surprised by the number of people who don't get jobs due to reverse racism and then find out for a fact this was the case. Generally with 'classic' racism you're left guessing. It seems implausible to me. Perhaps "its political correctness mate" is the go to excuse when your acquaintence fails an interview. HN seems to generally agree hiring is broken, so it shouldnt surprise people that good candidates dont get picked, but maybe we need a specific reason to feel better about it.
- anonymoushn 5y ago
  I received a written rejection from a software company stating that they would only consider non-males for junior dev roles. It seems like a lot of people just think this sort of thing is acceptable so they have no problem telling people about it.
  - rolleiflex 5y ago
    You should contact Department of Justice’s Civil Rights division. If what you say is true and you have this on paper, you should be able to get some actual justice on this. You can start filing a report here: https://civilrights.justice.gov/ https://civilrights.justice.gov/ I would implore you to do this — we have unfortunately allowed this kind of thing to happen in our industry for far too long. My condolences.
    - anonymoushn 5y ago
      The DFEH received an argument from the company along the lines of "The applicant did not fill out the official application on our web site, therefor they did not apply, therefor we did not discriminate against them" and agreed with it. So it's ok then for employees of the company to advertise an opening, to tell people that the way to apply for the opening is to email them directly, and to reply to the emails with rejections on the basis of gender, as long as some other part of the company also has some other application process! I have not followed up on the issue because my disability means that I have extremely limited capacity for this sort of thing and spending enormous amounts of that capacity for a minuscule chance at like $10,000 seems like a bad use of resources. I'm also no longer able to follow up on it! I understand that if I wanted justice, I had to get it within 18 months. Edit: I filled out the form at the DoJ. It would be sweet if something came of all this, even if I don't personally benefit.

pm90 5y ago

I’m sorry about what happened to you. However, your individual experience to the contrary does not counteract the general point.

colordrops 5y ago
And what exactly is the "general point"?
- garbagecoder 5y ago
  That reverse racism, especially against Asians, is real?
  - dragonwriter 5y ago
    Discrimination against Asians isn't “reverse racism” (to the extent that phrase is ever meaningful), in any sense, unless maybe it's in an environment where Asians historically hold disproportionate social power and have used it to systematically discriminate against non-Asians.
    - garbagecoder 5y ago
      I’m sorry you’re ignorant of history. There used to be laws like “Chinese Exclusion Acts” that were straight up racism based on a theory of racial inferiority of Asians. Now they are being punished for being academically superior in the name of equity, hence the reverse. Though I agree with you the phrase is mostly meaningless, to the extent it has meaning it’s exactly what I’ve described. Which you seem to agree with, so I’m not sure why you’re flaming me.
      - dragonwriter 5y ago
        > I’m sorry you’re ignorant of history. I’m...not. > There used to be laws like “Chinese Exclusion Acts” that were straight up racism based on a theory of racial inferiority of Asians. Yes, discrimination against Asians is quite common in US history, so any such current discrimination wouldn't be “reverse racism”.
        garbagecoder 5y ago
        Then what was your point? So, now there is such a thing as reverse racism? I think you just wanted to pick a fight. Be gone. It's reverse racism because they're being punished for their perceived or real superiority as I pointed out. If you can't at least understand that distinction in good faith, you're just arguing for the sake of it.
        Siira 5y ago
        The parent is trying to say that it’s just regular old racism. Competent Asians are disadvantaged because this serves the elite better. I think the reason underperforming minorities are so prioritized by the media and the elites is simply that the elites don’t feel much competitive pressure from them, and using them to distract the masses, they can then conveniently screw the minorities that are actually threatening their interests. Another reason is to delegitimize standardization of merit (e.g., standardized comprehensive exams). This allows them to use a subjective (“holistic”) approach that obviously favors themselves.

ZeroGravitas 5y ago

I'm surprised by the number of people who don't get jobs due to reverse racism and then find out for a fact this was the case. Generally with 'classic' racism you're left guessing. It seems implausible to me. Perhaps "its political correctness mate" is the go to excuse when your acquaintence fails an interview. HN seems to generally agree hiring is broken, so it shouldnt surprise people that good candidates dont get picked, but maybe we need a specific reason to feel better about it.

anonymoushn 5y ago
I received a written rejection from a software company stating that they would only consider non-males for junior dev roles. It seems like a lot of people just think this sort of thing is acceptable so they have no problem telling people about it.
- rolleiflex 5y ago
  You should contact Department of Justice’s Civil Rights division. If what you say is true and you have this on paper, you should be able to get some actual justice on this. You can start filing a report here: https://civilrights.justice.gov/ https://civilrights.justice.gov/ I would implore you to do this — we have unfortunately allowed this kind of thing to happen in our industry for far too long. My condolences.
  - anonymoushn 5y ago
    The DFEH received an argument from the company along the lines of "The applicant did not fill out the official application on our web site, therefor they did not apply, therefor we did not discriminate against them" and agreed with it. So it's ok then for employees of the company to advertise an opening, to tell people that the way to apply for the opening is to email them directly, and to reply to the emails with rejections on the basis of gender, as long as some other part of the company also has some other application process! I have not followed up on the issue because my disability means that I have extremely limited capacity for this sort of thing and spending enormous amounts of that capacity for a minuscule chance at like $10,000 seems like a bad use of resources. I'm also no longer able to follow up on it! I understand that if I wanted justice, I had to get it within 18 months. Edit: I filled out the form at the DoJ. It would be sweet if something came of all this, even if I don't personally benefit.