5 ms·

So my point exactly… it’s not catastrophic… it’s just shitty. “Nearly accident” is the same as “not an accident” and definitely not: catastrophic .

lolc 5y ago
Funny how the discussion of a serious system failure in aviation leads to a comment about how "it's just shitty" in a car.
- onethought 5y ago
  Given one happens at ~50km/h at 0 altitude vs ~400km/h at 30,000ft... makes sense. Just like bumping into someone while walking is way less serious than bumping into another car while driving.
  - PKop 5y ago
    You just keep adding nonsense to the discussion. Is self driving going to be limited to 50km/h? No it's not, so what are you talking about? Is crashing your car at 50km/h not potentially deadly or dangerous? Of course it is. So, what are you talking about? When planes typically fly in the air, how many other planes are nearby? 0 When cars drive on the road, how many other cars or pedestrians are nearby? Often many Just because planes get completely obliterated at the speeds they travel doesn't mean cars going much slower in accidents come out unscathed. This is like elementary school stuff here.
    - onethought 5y ago
      Apologises for triggering you here. I’m not meaning to troll, or add nonsense. I agree that there is a lot more going on with cars, as traffic and road conditions vary more than air traffic and sky conditions. But my response is the failures aren’t that bad in the car world. Autopilot (ie lane keep and cruise control) have been probably safer than human drivers. Navigate on autopilot is very stable, but limited to highway… that’s why I referred to the lower speed, because high speed is closer to solved. The hard part of full self driving, is city streets, which is typically lower speeds. The failure mode of FSD is typically for it to just stop… I have never seen a single failure where it full speeds into another object. This did seem to happen sometimes in autopilot in the past, but not FSD
      - lolc 5y ago
        > I have never seen a single failure where it full speeds into another object. What do you make of this near-miss posted recently? Allegedly, FSD was on when the car veered into the lane of an oncoming car. https://www.reddit.com/r/SelfDrivingCars/comments/re7vxr/fsd_beta_fail_reposting_video_that_was_taken_down/ https://www.reddit.com/r/SelfDrivingCars/comments/re7vxr/fsd...
        onethought 5y ago
        Agree that isn’t good. And definitely looked like it would collide. I guess if you agree to sign up to train the NN you need to accept the fact it’s going to do this stuff. As an aside, it seems strange to me that the high beams switch Off as they approach the oncoming car. Seems the driver disabled them… auto disabled would have meant they detected the car, which then seems unlikely they’d move into it’s path. But very hard to judge off camera alone… they might not even be on FSD. Shrug.
        dncornholio 5y ago
        Where do I sign up for not wanting oncoming Tesla's to take my lane? Where do the pedestrians sign up for not having a Tesla drive over their feet?
PKop 5y ago
>it’s not catastrophic… it’s just shitty This is because drivers are giving 100% attention to monitoring the car in these scenarios. So again, this means the tool is useless (right now it is), or if the driver stops paying attention and becomes an unfocused passenger (the actual point of self-driving) then the tool becomes absurdly deadly. Everywhere along this spectrum, as attention declines, catastrophic risk goes up. Self driving is vapor ware at best, a scandal at worst. It's not going to end well.

lolc 5y ago

Funny how the discussion of a serious system failure in aviation leads to a comment about how "it's just shitty" in a car.

onethought 5y ago
Given one happens at ~50km/h at 0 altitude vs ~400km/h at 30,000ft... makes sense. Just like bumping into someone while walking is way less serious than bumping into another car while driving.
- PKop 5y ago
  You just keep adding nonsense to the discussion. Is self driving going to be limited to 50km/h? No it's not, so what are you talking about? Is crashing your car at 50km/h not potentially deadly or dangerous? Of course it is. So, what are you talking about? When planes typically fly in the air, how many other planes are nearby? 0 When cars drive on the road, how many other cars or pedestrians are nearby? Often many Just because planes get completely obliterated at the speeds they travel doesn't mean cars going much slower in accidents come out unscathed. This is like elementary school stuff here.
  - onethought 5y ago
    Apologises for triggering you here. I’m not meaning to troll, or add nonsense. I agree that there is a lot more going on with cars, as traffic and road conditions vary more than air traffic and sky conditions. But my response is the failures aren’t that bad in the car world. Autopilot (ie lane keep and cruise control) have been probably safer than human drivers. Navigate on autopilot is very stable, but limited to highway… that’s why I referred to the lower speed, because high speed is closer to solved. The hard part of full self driving, is city streets, which is typically lower speeds. The failure mode of FSD is typically for it to just stop… I have never seen a single failure where it full speeds into another object. This did seem to happen sometimes in autopilot in the past, but not FSD
    - lolc 5y ago
      > I have never seen a single failure where it full speeds into another object. What do you make of this near-miss posted recently? Allegedly, FSD was on when the car veered into the lane of an oncoming car. https://www.reddit.com/r/SelfDrivingCars/comments/re7vxr/fsd_beta_fail_reposting_video_that_was_taken_down/ https://www.reddit.com/r/SelfDrivingCars/comments/re7vxr/fsd...
      - onethought 5y ago
        Agree that isn’t good. And definitely looked like it would collide. I guess if you agree to sign up to train the NN you need to accept the fact it’s going to do this stuff. As an aside, it seems strange to me that the high beams switch Off as they approach the oncoming car. Seems the driver disabled them… auto disabled would have meant they detected the car, which then seems unlikely they’d move into it’s path. But very hard to judge off camera alone… they might not even be on FSD. Shrug.
        dncornholio 5y ago
        Where do I sign up for not wanting oncoming Tesla's to take my lane? Where do the pedestrians sign up for not having a Tesla drive over their feet?

PKop 5y ago

>it’s not catastrophic… it’s just shitty This is because drivers are giving 100% attention to monitoring the car in these scenarios. So again, this means the tool is useless (right now it is), or if the driver stops paying attention and becomes an unfocused passenger (the actual point of self-driving) then the tool becomes absurdly deadly. Everywhere along this spectrum, as attention declines, catastrophic risk goes up. Self driving is vapor ware at best, a scandal at worst. It's not going to end well.