5 ms·

>"mass detention of minorities". It's Saddam-has-WMDs-and-is-allied-with-al-Qaeda These aren't equivalent. We have plenty of evidence of the Uyghur genocide fr

>"mass detention of minorities". It's Saddam-has-WMDs-and-is-allied-with-al-Qaeda These aren't equivalent. We have plenty of evidence of the Uyghur genocide from 3rd party journalists and satellite imagery. The only evidence for WMDs came directly from a new government agency (named "Office of Special Plans") created by Dick Cheney and not independently verified by any 3rd parties.

pphysch 5y ago
> We have plenty of evidence of the Uyghur genocide from 3rd party journalists and satellite imagery. No, we don't. The vast majority of primary "evidence" comes out of the ETIM lobby (WUC, Adrian Zenz, et al.) and war lobby (ASPI, etc). All of it massively signal-boosted by the mainstream corporate media. Both sources have a very, very clear (conflict of) interest in manufacturing anti-China sentiment. Grainy satellite imagery of ordinary schools and prisons is only admissible as "concentration camps" if you're a shameless propagandist. It's quite literally the same playbook as "Saddam's WMDs", with similarly cynical goals. Because it worked. And it's been similarly effective at duping the average media consumer.
- chillage 5y ago
  Not to throw the book at you but here is a pretty hugely detailed article with near 500 sources from very diverse media https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Uyghur_genocide https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Uyghur_genocide
  - pphysch 5y ago
    Linking a heavily manipulated Wikipedia article is the definition of fallacious book-throwing. Do you have any primary evidence that isn't blatant hearsay, Google Earth speculation, or bad-faith mistranslations? In my extensive research, virtually 100% of "the evidence" falls into these 3 easily manipulated categories. The year is 2022. There should be convincing photo and video evidence of the supposed atrocities. Western intelligence community has high-resolution aerial cameras. China has a billion people on social media, some using VPNs. There would certainly be whistleblowers. Smoking guns of this alleged Holocaust should be everywhere, on a daily basis. But they're suspiciously absent. WMDs all over again.
    - chillage 5y ago
      I mean no, I don't have a list with more than 500 sources for you, so if this one is insufficiently exhaustive then I guess we are at an impasse
      - pphysch 5y ago
        If you are acting in good faith, it should be easy for you to produce an example of primary evidence I requested from your Wikipedia page.
        chillage 5y ago
        If you are genuinely interested you can look through that page yourself to see if you can find evidence matching your stringent criteria :) I am not able to read your mind to guess what you’ll find convincing and am sure you can do your own research provided the starting point. In any case, have a wonderful day!
        pphysch 5y ago
        Nice deflection. Let me know when those WMDs show up.
        dillondoyle 5y ago
        I can't believe I'm replying to you it's so pointless but I can't help myself. There are tons of sources showing that the facilities you can see plainly in satellites are internment centers. And schools which you can see barbed wire etc. BUT how about looking at the opposite. What you can see erased. One can view a cultural genocide from the air plain as day. The erasure of Uighyer cultural and religious spaces. Just a couple sources below. Let me save you your reply, that's fake or some US government plot planted BS, that's not a primary source (even though the articles give the primary), etc. I read through your profile and I'm pretty surprised by the huge volume of consistent comments so I guess good for you ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/may/07/revealed-new-evidence-of-chinas-mission-to-raze-the-mosques-of-xinjiang https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/may/07/revealed-new-e... https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020/09/25/world/asia/xinjiang-china-religious-site.html https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020/09/25/world/asia/xi... https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/may/07/revealed-new-evidence-of-chinas-mission-to-raze-the-mosques-of-xinjiang https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/may/07/revealed-new-e...

pphysch 5y ago

> We have plenty of evidence of the Uyghur genocide from 3rd party journalists and satellite imagery. No, we don't. The vast majority of primary "evidence" comes out of the ETIM lobby (WUC, Adrian Zenz, et al.) and war lobby (ASPI, etc). All of it massively signal-boosted by the mainstream corporate media. Both sources have a very, very clear (conflict of) interest in manufacturing anti-China sentiment. Grainy satellite imagery of ordinary schools and prisons is only admissible as "concentration camps" if you're a shameless propagandist. It's quite literally the same playbook as "Saddam's WMDs", with similarly cynical goals. Because it worked. And it's been similarly effective at duping the average media consumer.

chillage 5y ago
Not to throw the book at you but here is a pretty hugely detailed article with near 500 sources from very diverse media https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Uyghur_genocide https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Uyghur_genocide
- pphysch 5y ago
  Linking a heavily manipulated Wikipedia article is the definition of fallacious book-throwing. Do you have any primary evidence that isn't blatant hearsay, Google Earth speculation, or bad-faith mistranslations? In my extensive research, virtually 100% of "the evidence" falls into these 3 easily manipulated categories. The year is 2022. There should be convincing photo and video evidence of the supposed atrocities. Western intelligence community has high-resolution aerial cameras. China has a billion people on social media, some using VPNs. There would certainly be whistleblowers. Smoking guns of this alleged Holocaust should be everywhere, on a daily basis. But they're suspiciously absent. WMDs all over again.
  - chillage 5y ago
    I mean no, I don't have a list with more than 500 sources for you, so if this one is insufficiently exhaustive then I guess we are at an impasse
    - pphysch 5y ago
      If you are acting in good faith, it should be easy for you to produce an example of primary evidence I requested from your Wikipedia page.
      - chillage 5y ago
        If you are genuinely interested you can look through that page yourself to see if you can find evidence matching your stringent criteria :) I am not able to read your mind to guess what you’ll find convincing and am sure you can do your own research provided the starting point. In any case, have a wonderful day!
        pphysch 5y ago
        Nice deflection. Let me know when those WMDs show up.
      - dillondoyle 5y ago
        I can't believe I'm replying to you it's so pointless but I can't help myself. There are tons of sources showing that the facilities you can see plainly in satellites are internment centers. And schools which you can see barbed wire etc. BUT how about looking at the opposite. What you can see erased. One can view a cultural genocide from the air plain as day. The erasure of Uighyer cultural and religious spaces. Just a couple sources below. Let me save you your reply, that's fake or some US government plot planted BS, that's not a primary source (even though the articles give the primary), etc. I read through your profile and I'm pretty surprised by the huge volume of consistent comments so I guess good for you ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/may/07/revealed-new-evidence-of-chinas-mission-to-raze-the-mosques-of-xinjiang https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/may/07/revealed-new-e... https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020/09/25/world/asia/xinjiang-china-religious-site.html https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020/09/25/world/asia/xi... https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/may/07/revealed-new-evidence-of-chinas-mission-to-raze-the-mosques-of-xinjiang https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/may/07/revealed-new-e...