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There is a lot of innovation in the programming language space, see what node.js is doing with javascript (I still remember the days when everyone let all the J

by rabc 15y ago

There is a lot of innovation in the programming language space, see what node.js is doing with javascript (I still remember the days when everyone let all the JS code to juniors programmers because no one liked JS). Google should focus on fixing what's already done, not re-inventing the wheel again.

munificent 15y ago
> what node.js is doing with javascript How is node.js innovating in the language space?
- rabc 15y ago
  Giving a new way to work with it, making you rethink your async patterns. node.js created a new world to work with JS, making it more powerful.
  - jerf 15y ago
    It created a new world to work with in JS... by copying the async frameworks that already existed in numerous other languages. Innovative within Javascript, sure. Innovative, without further qualifications? Decades too late for that.
  - munificent 15y ago
    > making you rethink your async patterns. Call me crazy, but I don't consider forcing users to manually transform their code into hard-to-read continuation passing form much of a language innovation. > node.js created a new world to work with JS, making it more powerful. Sure, it gave it a new environment to run in, but it didn't make the language any more powerful than applets made Java the language more innovative.
  - dasil003 15y ago
    Node's primary innovation is in terms of A) unifying JS on a single high-performance platform and B) creating an ecosystem from the ground up where thread-safety is required at all times. These innovations are significant, especially at the boots-on-the-ground level. That said, when people speak about lack of innovation in programming languages I think they are looking for more fundamentally new ideas. I don't want to be a cynic—all ideas are derivative after all—but I don't think Node qualifies.
  - yzhengyu 15y ago
    Hmm, I would reckon node.js is popular because of its inherent simplicity and tapping the greater javascript community, which is by far the most vibrant and energetic I have seen. The things that it introduced - asynchronous, modelling as events, single thread execution - are not really new and already exist as libraries/frameworks [varying in increasing complexity] in Python, Java and Ruby. Not that I am knocking node. If anything, its good more people are opening up to alternative, sometimes better, ways of modelling and execution.
fogus 15y ago
see what node.js is doing Granted, Node.js is nice and all, but it's hardly innovative. It's built on an old language using ancient async tricks running on a VM built using old performance techniques learned during the development of an old language.
- hasenj 15y ago
  Putting a whole bunch of existing ideas together into a new form is what innovation is all about.
  - sjwright 15y ago
    Putting a whole bunch of existing ideas together into a new form is what patent law is all about stifling.
- shortcharles 15y ago
  If your universe has a mere 400 old software ideas, and you choose 4 (e.g. JS, async, VM, hidden objects) your combination is one out of 1 050 739 900. That is the mathematics of innovation.

by rabc 15y ago

munificent 15y ago

> what node.js is doing with javascript How is node.js innovating in the language space?

rabc 15y ago
Giving a new way to work with it, making you rethink your async patterns. node.js created a new world to work with JS, making it more powerful.
- jerf 15y ago
  It created a new world to work with in JS... by copying the async frameworks that already existed in numerous other languages. Innovative within Javascript, sure. Innovative, without further qualifications? Decades too late for that.
- munificent 15y ago
  > making you rethink your async patterns. Call me crazy, but I don't consider forcing users to manually transform their code into hard-to-read continuation passing form much of a language innovation. > node.js created a new world to work with JS, making it more powerful. Sure, it gave it a new environment to run in, but it didn't make the language any more powerful than applets made Java the language more innovative.
- dasil003 15y ago
  Node's primary innovation is in terms of A) unifying JS on a single high-performance platform and B) creating an ecosystem from the ground up where thread-safety is required at all times. These innovations are significant, especially at the boots-on-the-ground level. That said, when people speak about lack of innovation in programming languages I think they are looking for more fundamentally new ideas. I don't want to be a cynic—all ideas are derivative after all—but I don't think Node qualifies.
- yzhengyu 15y ago
  Hmm, I would reckon node.js is popular because of its inherent simplicity and tapping the greater javascript community, which is by far the most vibrant and energetic I have seen. The things that it introduced - asynchronous, modelling as events, single thread execution - are not really new and already exist as libraries/frameworks [varying in increasing complexity] in Python, Java and Ruby. Not that I am knocking node. If anything, its good more people are opening up to alternative, sometimes better, ways of modelling and execution.

fogus 15y ago

see what node.js is doing Granted, Node.js is nice and all, but it's hardly innovative. It's built on an old language using ancient async tricks running on a VM built using old performance techniques learned during the development of an old language.

hasenj 15y ago
Putting a whole bunch of existing ideas together into a new form is what innovation is all about.
- sjwright 15y ago
  Putting a whole bunch of existing ideas together into a new form is what patent law is all about stifling.
shortcharles 15y ago
If your universe has a mere 400 old software ideas, and you choose 4 (e.g. JS, async, VM, hidden objects) your combination is one out of 1 050 739 900. That is the mathematics of innovation.