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With all due respect, the point of all these crypto buzzwords is to forgo what's 'good' for [centralized] businesses in favor of what users want. I can imagine

With all due respect, the point of all these crypto buzzwords is to forgo what's 'good' for [centralized] businesses in favor of what users want. I can imagine the vast majority of Diablo players (assuming the market was ran legitimately) would prefer to still have the market, while Blizzard discovered they could make more money closing it. A high ideal (to me) for web3 is that users can uphold the system they want and be compensated for doing so at the same time. While the web3 example still features a creator and early investors who may make the most money, users will prefer the market which promises to stay up via its contract code. We may be a long way from enough users understanding this to influence developers, and it may never reach that perfectly, but that's the direction web3 can hopefully push things.

dmitriid 5y ago
> the point of all these crypto buzzwords is to forgo what's 'good' for [centralized] businesses in favor of what users want. The point I was replying to was literally this: "Web3 technologies can enable an ecosystem for this without a bunch of bespoke work that likely isn't core to what a business is trying to achieve." The core business can actually be hurt by unchecked trading of items. > I can imagine the vast majority of Diablo players (assuming the market was ran legitimately) would prefer to still have the market Why don't you go and ask the vast majority of Diablo players before making these assumptions? > We may be a long way from enough users understanding this to influence developers, How do you "influence developers" by trading some items outside the core of what the developers are building? BTW, building tradable items can and usually is still outside the core of what business is building. > but that's the direction web3 can hopefully push things. Ah yes, the hope that web3 may push towards unchecked trading of meaningless items (meaningless outside the game/business in question) that actually ruins the core game experience.
- mattwilsonn888 5y ago
  > The core business can actually be hurt by unchecked trading of items. Again, that's the point. Its obvious centralized market makers only make money when they control the market and limit market freedom, which is why its easy to imagine the players in general would prefer to avoid such a tax/manipulation/centralizing forces. > How do you "influence developers" by trading some items outside the core of what the developers are building? By placing personal value in systems that give users more freedom and assurance of the protocols they initially bought into. When people can understand that that is what they are being offered with a 'web3' approach, they can influence developers to build what's most demanded, i.e. basic economics. > Ah yes, the hope that web3 may push towards unchecked trading of meaningless items (meaningless outside the game/business in question) that actually ruins the core game experience. Ahh so Diablo items are meaningless now? Maybe to you, but certainly not to many other players as you've demonstrated. What about decentralized exchange protocols is unchecked? Its as safe as the blockchain itself - perhaps you are thinking of government regulations.
  - dmitriid 5y ago
    > Again, that's the point. Core gameplay: is being hurt by players only chasing it in hoping to make money Cryptopeddlers: yes, that's the point. Thank you. > they can influence developers to build what's most demanded, i.e. basic economics. Core gameplay: is being hurt by players only chasing it in hoping to make money Cryptopeddlers: yes, that's the point. That's what devs should build: ways to monetize assets in the game. That's what influence and basic economics is! > Ahh so Diablo items are meaningless now? Maybe to you, but certainly not to many other players as you've demonstrated. What part of "meaningless outside Diablo" did you not understand? Don't bother. Judging by your answers there's very little of what you understood from my message.
    - mattwilsonn888 5y ago
      > Core gameplay: is being hurt by players only chasing it in hoping to make money That's just your opinion, man. I've heard from more Diablo players than just you that they dearly miss it. But I guess if all the value of your game is extracted to the team running the servers and zero of it to players is what you find compelling, feel free to fritter away on centralized grinding for truly and practically worthless pixels. Clearly those items weren't meaningless outside Diablo when they sold for real money. How thick can you be? You think its that impossible to decentralize a market? You think it hasn't already been done?
      - dmitriid 5y ago
        > That's just your opinion, man. I've heard from more Diablo players than just you that they dearly miss it. It's amazing how you totally dismiss the opinion of all the players who didn't like and didn't want the marketplace as irrelevant > But I guess if all the value of your game is extracted to the team running the servers and zero of it to players Ah yes, making a better game whose goal is no longer a rush to monetize assets is "giving no value to the players". > Clearly those items weren't meaningless outside Diablo when they sold for real money. How thick can you be Because they literally have no meaning or value outside the game for which they were designed and that only work within that game. > You think its that impossible to decentralize a market? Ah yes. The good old "let's pretend my opponent said and thought this thing and bravely fight this argument I invented for my opponent"

dmitriid 5y ago

> the point of all these crypto buzzwords is to forgo what's 'good' for [centralized] businesses in favor of what users want. The point I was replying to was literally this: "Web3 technologies can enable an ecosystem for this without a bunch of bespoke work that likely isn't core to what a business is trying to achieve." The core business can actually be hurt by unchecked trading of items. > I can imagine the vast majority of Diablo players (assuming the market was ran legitimately) would prefer to still have the market Why don't you go and ask the vast majority of Diablo players before making these assumptions? > We may be a long way from enough users understanding this to influence developers, How do you "influence developers" by trading some items outside the core of what the developers are building? BTW, building tradable items can and usually is still outside the core of what business is building. > but that's the direction web3 can hopefully push things. Ah yes, the hope that web3 may push towards unchecked trading of meaningless items (meaningless outside the game/business in question) that actually ruins the core game experience.

mattwilsonn888 5y ago
> The core business can actually be hurt by unchecked trading of items. Again, that's the point. Its obvious centralized market makers only make money when they control the market and limit market freedom, which is why its easy to imagine the players in general would prefer to avoid such a tax/manipulation/centralizing forces. > How do you "influence developers" by trading some items outside the core of what the developers are building? By placing personal value in systems that give users more freedom and assurance of the protocols they initially bought into. When people can understand that that is what they are being offered with a 'web3' approach, they can influence developers to build what's most demanded, i.e. basic economics. > Ah yes, the hope that web3 may push towards unchecked trading of meaningless items (meaningless outside the game/business in question) that actually ruins the core game experience. Ahh so Diablo items are meaningless now? Maybe to you, but certainly not to many other players as you've demonstrated. What about decentralized exchange protocols is unchecked? Its as safe as the blockchain itself - perhaps you are thinking of government regulations.
- dmitriid 5y ago
  > Again, that's the point. Core gameplay: is being hurt by players only chasing it in hoping to make money Cryptopeddlers: yes, that's the point. Thank you. > they can influence developers to build what's most demanded, i.e. basic economics. Core gameplay: is being hurt by players only chasing it in hoping to make money Cryptopeddlers: yes, that's the point. That's what devs should build: ways to monetize assets in the game. That's what influence and basic economics is! > Ahh so Diablo items are meaningless now? Maybe to you, but certainly not to many other players as you've demonstrated. What part of "meaningless outside Diablo" did you not understand? Don't bother. Judging by your answers there's very little of what you understood from my message.
  - mattwilsonn888 5y ago
    > Core gameplay: is being hurt by players only chasing it in hoping to make money That's just your opinion, man. I've heard from more Diablo players than just you that they dearly miss it. But I guess if all the value of your game is extracted to the team running the servers and zero of it to players is what you find compelling, feel free to fritter away on centralized grinding for truly and practically worthless pixels. Clearly those items weren't meaningless outside Diablo when they sold for real money. How thick can you be? You think its that impossible to decentralize a market? You think it hasn't already been done?
    - dmitriid 5y ago
      > That's just your opinion, man. I've heard from more Diablo players than just you that they dearly miss it. It's amazing how you totally dismiss the opinion of all the players who didn't like and didn't want the marketplace as irrelevant > But I guess if all the value of your game is extracted to the team running the servers and zero of it to players Ah yes, making a better game whose goal is no longer a rush to monetize assets is "giving no value to the players". > Clearly those items weren't meaningless outside Diablo when they sold for real money. How thick can you be Because they literally have no meaning or value outside the game for which they were designed and that only work within that game. > You think its that impossible to decentralize a market? Ah yes. The good old "let's pretend my opponent said and thought this thing and bravely fight this argument I invented for my opponent"