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The gate keepers are preventing me from building the kind of apps I want. Just the other day people here reminisced about the days when Twitter used to have an
by Kiro 5y ago
The gate keepers are preventing me from building the kind of apps I want. Just the other day people here reminisced about the days when Twitter used to have an open API and how bad it is that they shut it down.
I want to build apps without having to worry about ever being restricted, limited or shut down.
- jcun4128 5y agoI was thinking about this, not sure if entirely the same. For example the YT dislikes going away. What if you got people to install a chrome extension where it tracked urls with upvotes/downvotes (game system). The database is shared between installed apps no central db... would it work? I could be far off with the intent of the application but another example is mesh networking where it is nice to not have a central pipe but is it going to be as good, particularly the case of cross continent.
- mattwilsonn888 5y agoThis is the kind of thing that inspires true Web3 people (not the grifters selling their OpenSea NFTs). If you dig into the problems that arise when implementing those systems you talk about and what happens when data of value can be contributed, you start naturally running into the solutions that Blockchain developers have been working on for years.
- dmitriid 5y ago> I want to build apps without having to worry about ever being restricted, limited or shut down. So. Where's blockchain-powered Twitters and Facebooks then? For all the talk about gatekeeping and decentralization no actual apps appeared that would in any way support your words.
- jazzyjackson 5y agoThere's Bitclout (Re-branded to "DeSo"/diamondapp.com) but it suffers from the same blocksize debate as anybody. No way to stay sync'd if it actually became popular, which it didn't because every new user had to learn how tell real accounts from fake lookalikes.
- Kiro 5y agoI don't know and who said anything about blockchain? I'm just telling you what I want. I have no interest or obligation in proving anything besides that.
- dmitriid 5y agoOkay. "Blockchain and crypto aside", where are the fully decentralized Facebooks and Twitters without gatekeepers?
- Kiro 5y agoWhy would I know? No-one has built it yet? It's not technically possible? There's no demand for it? You seem to be insinuating something so please elaborate.
- dmitriid 5y ago> Why would I know? You're the one proclaiming and wanting things. > No-one has built it yet? It's not technically possible? There's no demand for it? Yes, yes, and yes, to varying degrees? You're so close to getting it.
- Kiro 5y agoYes, and none of this changes the fact that I still want it. Now you hopefully get it as well.
- jshen 5y agoThis isn't what users want in general, and you don't need crypto to get it. What you're asking for exists with things like mastodon. No one advocating how/why they think crypto will succeed when things like mastodon failed. Hell, RSS failed. The average user wants easy to use, easy to connect, free, and fast services. Crypto fails at all of these.
- mattwilsonn888 5y agoThe narrative driving Web3 is that people don't want to be treated like cattle. Or in your parlance, "the average user." Just because people are slow to wake with the contracts they made with centralized platforms doesn't mean they are so dull as to not care when they finally figure it out.
- jshen 5y agoPeople want things to be cheap and convenient. Convincing yourself otherwise is a mistake.
- mattwilsonn888 5y agoFalse dichotomy. Convincing yourself that all blockchain will ever be is data posted in Bitcoin PKscripts is embarrassing.
- jshen 5y ago
- mattwilsonn888 5y ago
- jshen 5y ago
- shagie 5y ago> I want to build apps without having to worry about ever being restricted, limited or shut down. I'm still not clear how this would work. In a web 3 twitter clone that prevents one from ever being "restricted, limited or shut down", where does the crypto-tweet live? Where is it stored? How well does this scale? What does it take to crypto-tweet (do you have to pay some crypto currency to have it be out there)? What happens if you want to redact it later? What is the energy cost of putting a crypto-tweet out there? What would be the overall energy and storage costs be across all devices for a single crypto-tweet? What would the costs be if this was to scale to 1% of Twitter (Twitter is 6k tweets/s so this would be 60 crypto-tweets/second)? If the above doesn't reflect the proper design of a crypto-twitter, what would that look like? One of the classic system design questions is "how would you implement twitter" and so that's something that nearly every software developer has thought about at one point or another... and so if I've got the wrong questions fro crypto-twitter, how is it designed and what are the right questions to ask about such a design?
- ShamelessC 5y agoIf I may summarize the typical response? TBD
- mattwilsonn888 5y agoTo start you Tweet off chain, and you only verify on chain. Most of the skeptics here seem to take pride in their shallow understanding of blockchain - most of these questions are posed with some idea that people want to post a million tweets a day on the Bitcoin blockchain. People smart enough to answer your questions don't actually hang out here - I would know, because I hang out with them where they are welcome. And yes, those people also make a distinction between themselves and the average grifter - something HN fails miserably at.
- simooooo 5y ago
- epistasis 5y agoOk so if the data is off chain for the tweets, that off-chain resource becomes the gatekeeper, doesn't it? I am becoming convinced that there may be value somewhere in this open database, but I'm also convinced that 99% of the people advocating for web3 and making a ton of "money" on current token speculation do not know what this value will be. The most convincing application I can think of is a PGP for the modern world that everyone can use without hours and hours of tech training. But I think there will be more.
- ShamelessC 5y ago> I want to build apps without having to worry about ever being restricted, limited or shut down. I'm not at all convinced that technology from "web3" or ethereum or whatever can actually do this. Please don't tell me it's coming soon or just a matter of time. That's been said for ten years.
- Kiro 5y agoRead my original comment again. I'm not advocating for blockchain or crypto. My point was that you should not conflate decentralization with these buzz words and dismiss it by affiliation. I don't know when this is coming or if it's coming at all but it's what I want.
- ShamelessC 5y agoApologies, I misread. Indeed, the future you want is here now and you can start today. For real. The decentralized version of the internet exists in many forms. Pick one and build your thing.
- ShamelessC 5y ago> I want to build apps without having to worry about ever being restricted, limited or shut down. What is stopping you from storing HTML/CSS on torrent/IPFS/github/pastebin? This stuff exists - right now. Your version of it just adds an unnecessary barrier to entry.
- Kiro 5y agoWhat is "my" version? I haven't said anything about implementation. IPFS is a great example of what I'm talking about.