4 ms·

> That basically makes the Carbon/dirty production a luxury Unfortunately this is very far from the reality. It's the rich that own Teslas, and the poor that n

> That basically makes the Carbon/dirty production a luxury Unfortunately this is very far from the reality. It's the rich that own Teslas, and the poor that need to use a diesel car to commute to work because they can't afford to live in the city center. Carbon taxes affect the poor more than the rich.

rich_sasha 5y ago
There’s plenty of much cheaper electric cars made in Europe. Though I agree, this works with incentives added from governments. But then there will be carbon taxes to spend so that works I think.
- fogihujy 5y ago
  Most poor people rarely have new cars; until you can buy a used but functional 400€ EV, carbon taxes will be harder on the working poor. Public transport is nice, and it could cover some of that, but it will never be available everywhere and at all times.
  - rich_sasha 5y ago
    I quite like the idea of progressive carbon taxes btw. Everyone has an annual allowance for basic living necessities-this may include eg driving their old car to work or hearing their house. Anything on top - air travel, second homes, big cars etc - you pay for the carbon. Maybe doesn’t sound like it’s converting to 0, but at least it differentiates between optional and essential fossil fuel use (or socialises the cost of carbon removal if you prefer).
    - fogihujy 5y ago
      The basic idea isn't bad, assuming it's implemented in a sensible way. However, the most likely result will be higher fuel prices -- until the lack of income starts hurting governments and "carbon taxes" are added on top of electricity prices instead, regardlessif the energy is green or not.
wumpus 5y ago
Try googling [carbon tax rebate], it might be interesting.
maxdo 5y ago
that's why it's better to do it in phases. In 2023 there are several projects of $20-25k EV car with mileage good to go to any suburbs. With EV been a cheaper source compares to Disel it's no brainer. Timing is a king in this transition. What opens such a lucrative pricing for car manufactures? battery production improvements on a scale created by the demand. By applying import tax in 2025 you can set a clear target for companies that yet doesn't have such plans despite tech enabling advancements. I used "progressive" to use same principle. You have same brakets, but instead of money tax payer/importer checks emission points. If you are within average, you're good, no taxes, slightly higher - some taxes, dirty economy, very high tax. And with phases we can just change what is normal. So that government put the automatic pressure on most dirty economies, but also will show the path to the rest.

rich_sasha 5y ago

There’s plenty of much cheaper electric cars made in Europe. Though I agree, this works with incentives added from governments. But then there will be carbon taxes to spend so that works I think.

fogihujy 5y ago
Most poor people rarely have new cars; until you can buy a used but functional 400€ EV, carbon taxes will be harder on the working poor. Public transport is nice, and it could cover some of that, but it will never be available everywhere and at all times.
- rich_sasha 5y ago
  I quite like the idea of progressive carbon taxes btw. Everyone has an annual allowance for basic living necessities-this may include eg driving their old car to work or hearing their house. Anything on top - air travel, second homes, big cars etc - you pay for the carbon. Maybe doesn’t sound like it’s converting to 0, but at least it differentiates between optional and essential fossil fuel use (or socialises the cost of carbon removal if you prefer).
  - fogihujy 5y ago
    The basic idea isn't bad, assuming it's implemented in a sensible way. However, the most likely result will be higher fuel prices -- until the lack of income starts hurting governments and "carbon taxes" are added on top of electricity prices instead, regardlessif the energy is green or not.

wumpus 5y ago

Try googling [carbon tax rebate], it might be interesting.

maxdo 5y ago

that's why it's better to do it in phases. In 2023 there are several projects of $20-25k EV car with mileage good to go to any suburbs. With EV been a cheaper source compares to Disel it's no brainer. Timing is a king in this transition. What opens such a lucrative pricing for car manufactures? battery production improvements on a scale created by the demand. By applying import tax in 2025 you can set a clear target for companies that yet doesn't have such plans despite tech enabling advancements. I used "progressive" to use same principle. You have same brakets, but instead of money tax payer/importer checks emission points. If you are within average, you're good, no taxes, slightly higher - some taxes, dirty economy, very high tax. And with phases we can just change what is normal. So that government put the automatic pressure on most dirty economies, but also will show the path to the rest.