4 ms·

I know this story is baffling enough, but these things are nearly identical to gold dodecahedra found in South East Asia. See figure 3. https://journals.opened

I know this story is baffling enough, but these things are nearly identical to gold dodecahedra found in South East Asia. See figure 3. https://journals.openedition.org/archeosciences/2072 https://journals.openedition.org/archeosciences/2072

sen 5y ago
A trinket used in trading maybe? They’re way too close to he a coincidence.
- jjeaff 5y ago
  I've long wondered if several millennia in the future people might find frequent fossilized remains of certain mundane objects from today and try to ascribe some deep social significance or complex technical function to them. For example, these decorative balls that seem to be in bowls on so many American dinner or side tables. https://secure.img1-fg.wfcdn.com/im/13146084/resize-h755-w755%5Ecompr-r85/1516/151626206/9Pcs+3.5Inch+Woven+Wicker+Rattan+Balls+Decorative+Ball+Twig+Orbs+Green+Orbs+Vase+Bowl+Filler+For+Tabletop+Decoration.jpg https://secure.img1-fg.wfcdn.com/im/13146084/resize-h755-w75... Or perhaps they will think they are so bizarre extinct ocean animal.
  - kingcharles 5y ago
    LOL. That's actually a really good example.
  - couchand 5y ago
    Sounds like the premise of David Macaulay's Motel of the Mysteries.
  - labster 5y ago
    These undersea creatures were so highly prized that the ancients kept them in small caches, or “tide pods”, in their living quarters. The surviving sources recommend strongly against swallowing anything in a tide pod, so it is assumed they were poisonous unless properly prepared.
    - b112 5y ago
      Nice touch w the tide pod.
  - lkrubner 5y ago
    Almost any internal part of a large machine would be inscrutable. Most are inscrutable even now. If you handed an automobile carburetor to a person under 35 they would struggle to identify it, and even if you handed it to a car mechanic, 25 or younger, they would struggle to identify it, as fuel injection became standard by the 1990s and old cars with carburetors largely vanished by 2010 or 2015. And yet anyone 50 or older will remember seeing them in their cars any time they popped the hood. A central fuse box has been standard in all new homes since at least 1945 if not 1930, so if you hand someone a disposable fuse from 1930, would they be able to guess the purpose? My dad was a photographer from 1950 to 2007 and he kept the "dark room" in the basement of our house, a large room full of thousands of objects. He was an expert and dodging and burning, decades before Photoshop. He created his own tools for the dodging and burning, typically by taking a coat hanger and bending to the right shape, then attaching some cardboard and wrapping it with tape. It was a specialist tool and even in 1970 or so, 99.99% of the people on the planet would not have been able to guess the purpose.
    - Kye 5y ago
      Disposable fuses are a staple of horror movies, so more people could identify one than you might think.
    - bradknowles 5y ago
      With respect, I’m over 50, and the only reason I know anything at all about carburetors is that my cousin has built them for decades for use in race cars. Still does, as a side job. But Destin on “Smarter Every Day” taught me way more about them than I ever learned from my cousin.
    - fingerlocks 5y ago
      carburetors exist on more than just cars. Lawnmowers, ATVs, motorcycles, etc. Given that someone is already skilled in engine maintenance, seems unlikely they wouldn’t recognize a common engine component in all classic cars and most small engines. Furthermore, what’s with the argument that someone would be completely unfamiliar with an object/event/concept that existed before their time? I see this argument used from time to time, and it’s baffling. Are you completely unfamiliar with everything that was not longer manufactured after you were born? Does it surprise you that a ton of young people are interested in restoring classic vehicles (and electric retrofits) and there is a large online community of such?
  - blowski 5y ago
    I think it was Carl Sagan who wrote about the 20th Century religious sites all over the world, each one with a giant yellow M.
    - richardfey 5y ago
      Interesting, how do I search for this?
      - seanhunter 5y ago
        Researchers have plotted their locations but no-one is sure of their significance https://images.huffingtonpost.com/2011-11-09-mcsparenesness0909.jpg https://images.huffingtonpost.com/2011-11-09-mcsparenesness0... I think the quote probably comes from "The Demon-haunted World" but I read it a very long time ago so I may be wrong.
aaaaaaaaaaab 5y ago
Wikipedia: “Smaller dodecahedra with the same features (holes and knobs) and made from gold have been found in South-East Asia along the Maritime Silk Road. They have been used for decorative purposes and the earliest items appear to be from the Roman epoch.”
- rapjr9 5y ago
  Interesting idea. I did a search for Latin words that have no known meaning and found this: https://latin.stackexchange.com/questions/4683/what-is-the-most-common-classical-latin-word-that-we-dont-understand https://latin.stackexchange.com/questions/4683/what-is-the-m... which suggests a corslet being stiffened with "pale mountain bronze". Perhaps the "pale mountain bronze" is in the form of a dodecahedron? Then did a search for ancient images of women wearing toga's and found this: https://i.pinimg.com/originals/61/29/74/612974bb3612d3ccf9c98a95f9a58a9c.jpg https://i.pinimg.com/originals/61/29/74/612974bb3612d3ccf9c9... Look at her shoulders. Maybe these dodecahedra were ornamental fasteners for clothing, with the different hole sizes allowing them to be used with different weights of fabric. So perhaps they were a fad fashion adornment for rich women (due to the cost of the precision manufacture). I could see the smaller ones being used as a weight attached to clothing to control the drape and accentuate the figure as well. Pull some cloth through it, tie a knot and it pulls on the cloth in a certain way. A hair ornament would make sense also, with the different sized holes allowing for pulling differing amounts of hair through the holes and knotting the hair to hold the ornament in place.
- marginalia_nu 5y ago
  Is it really surprising to find roman-style artifacts along a major roman trading route?
  - dr_dshiv 5y ago
    SE Asia was not exactly a known "major" Roman trading route. Do you know otherwise?
    - marginalia_nu 5y ago

sen 5y ago

A trinket used in trading maybe? They’re way too close to he a coincidence.

jjeaff 5y ago
I've long wondered if several millennia in the future people might find frequent fossilized remains of certain mundane objects from today and try to ascribe some deep social significance or complex technical function to them. For example, these decorative balls that seem to be in bowls on so many American dinner or side tables. https://secure.img1-fg.wfcdn.com/im/13146084/resize-h755-w755%5Ecompr-r85/1516/151626206/9Pcs+3.5Inch+Woven+Wicker+Rattan+Balls+Decorative+Ball+Twig+Orbs+Green+Orbs+Vase+Bowl+Filler+For+Tabletop+Decoration.jpg https://secure.img1-fg.wfcdn.com/im/13146084/resize-h755-w75... Or perhaps they will think they are so bizarre extinct ocean animal.
- kingcharles 5y ago
  LOL. That's actually a really good example.
- couchand 5y ago
  Sounds like the premise of David Macaulay's Motel of the Mysteries.
- labster 5y ago
  These undersea creatures were so highly prized that the ancients kept them in small caches, or “tide pods”, in their living quarters. The surviving sources recommend strongly against swallowing anything in a tide pod, so it is assumed they were poisonous unless properly prepared.
  - b112 5y ago
    Nice touch w the tide pod.
- lkrubner 5y ago
  Almost any internal part of a large machine would be inscrutable. Most are inscrutable even now. If you handed an automobile carburetor to a person under 35 they would struggle to identify it, and even if you handed it to a car mechanic, 25 or younger, they would struggle to identify it, as fuel injection became standard by the 1990s and old cars with carburetors largely vanished by 2010 or 2015. And yet anyone 50 or older will remember seeing them in their cars any time they popped the hood. A central fuse box has been standard in all new homes since at least 1945 if not 1930, so if you hand someone a disposable fuse from 1930, would they be able to guess the purpose? My dad was a photographer from 1950 to 2007 and he kept the "dark room" in the basement of our house, a large room full of thousands of objects. He was an expert and dodging and burning, decades before Photoshop. He created his own tools for the dodging and burning, typically by taking a coat hanger and bending to the right shape, then attaching some cardboard and wrapping it with tape. It was a specialist tool and even in 1970 or so, 99.99% of the people on the planet would not have been able to guess the purpose.
  - Kye 5y ago
    Disposable fuses are a staple of horror movies, so more people could identify one than you might think.
  - bradknowles 5y ago
    With respect, I’m over 50, and the only reason I know anything at all about carburetors is that my cousin has built them for decades for use in race cars. Still does, as a side job. But Destin on “Smarter Every Day” taught me way more about them than I ever learned from my cousin.
  - fingerlocks 5y ago
    carburetors exist on more than just cars. Lawnmowers, ATVs, motorcycles, etc. Given that someone is already skilled in engine maintenance, seems unlikely they wouldn’t recognize a common engine component in all classic cars and most small engines. Furthermore, what’s with the argument that someone would be completely unfamiliar with an object/event/concept that existed before their time? I see this argument used from time to time, and it’s baffling. Are you completely unfamiliar with everything that was not longer manufactured after you were born? Does it surprise you that a ton of young people are interested in restoring classic vehicles (and electric retrofits) and there is a large online community of such?
- blowski 5y ago
  I think it was Carl Sagan who wrote about the 20th Century religious sites all over the world, each one with a giant yellow M.
  - richardfey 5y ago
    Interesting, how do I search for this?
    - seanhunter 5y ago
      Researchers have plotted their locations but no-one is sure of their significance https://images.huffingtonpost.com/2011-11-09-mcsparenesness0909.jpg https://images.huffingtonpost.com/2011-11-09-mcsparenesness0... I think the quote probably comes from "The Demon-haunted World" but I read it a very long time ago so I may be wrong.

aaaaaaaaaaab 5y ago

Wikipedia: “Smaller dodecahedra with the same features (holes and knobs) and made from gold have been found in South-East Asia along the Maritime Silk Road. They have been used for decorative purposes and the earliest items appear to be from the Roman epoch.”

rapjr9 5y ago
Interesting idea. I did a search for Latin words that have no known meaning and found this: https://latin.stackexchange.com/questions/4683/what-is-the-most-common-classical-latin-word-that-we-dont-understand https://latin.stackexchange.com/questions/4683/what-is-the-m... which suggests a corslet being stiffened with "pale mountain bronze". Perhaps the "pale mountain bronze" is in the form of a dodecahedron? Then did a search for ancient images of women wearing toga's and found this: https://i.pinimg.com/originals/61/29/74/612974bb3612d3ccf9c98a95f9a58a9c.jpg https://i.pinimg.com/originals/61/29/74/612974bb3612d3ccf9c9... Look at her shoulders. Maybe these dodecahedra were ornamental fasteners for clothing, with the different hole sizes allowing them to be used with different weights of fabric. So perhaps they were a fad fashion adornment for rich women (due to the cost of the precision manufacture). I could see the smaller ones being used as a weight attached to clothing to control the drape and accentuate the figure as well. Pull some cloth through it, tie a knot and it pulls on the cloth in a certain way. A hair ornament would make sense also, with the different sized holes allowing for pulling differing amounts of hair through the holes and knotting the hair to hold the ornament in place.
marginalia_nu 5y ago
Is it really surprising to find roman-style artifacts along a major roman trading route?
- dr_dshiv 5y ago
  SE Asia was not exactly a known "major" Roman trading route. Do you know otherwise?
  - marginalia_nu 5y ago