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> Yes, such as when you use someone's creative work contrary to their express desire. No, that's not theft. That's infringement of rights. But I speak with m

> Yes, such as when you use someone's creative work contrary to their express desire. No, that's not theft. That's infringement of rights. But I speak with many artists and creators, they are more mad than me, I have a job where I get paid no matter what the result is, because they pay for my time. they are between a rock and a stone: accept to work for these platforms and get paid shit, while they nmake billion, or don't and get paid shit, but at least own your work. Guess which way many are starting to take... > The principled, ethical stance is not to watch things you don't want to pay for. according to what ethical stance, exactly? yours? do you really think it is so relevant? or the ethic of corporations, which is objectively something to stay way from.

acdha 5y ago
> they are between a rock and a stone: accept to work for these platforms and get paid shit, while they nmake billion, or don't and get paid shit, but at least own your work. Guess which way many are starting to take... Again, I'm not saying that the current situation is great but if you were really concerned about artists being fairly compensated you would not take the action which results in them not getting paid. You could buy directly from the artist or you can go without, but taking advantage of their work without the agreed upon compensation calls your motives into question.
- peoplefromibiza 5y ago
  > Again, I'm not saying that the current situation is great but if you were really concerned about artists being fairly compensated you would not take the action which results in them not getting paid. Are you saying that if I ask an artist to make a painting for me and the painting get stolen AFTER they made it, I am allowed to not pay the artist? That's a really strange POV. Media companies should pay artists, not me. I am only paying for their services, not for the content, which I can get in many other ways or not get it at all, which is an option too, but by your logic not watching the content would lead to artists not getting paid so I should feel bad about that too... I am not the one monetizing artists' work and they are not doing it because I am paying, but because media companies hired them to do their job. Again: sorry, not sorry!
  - acdha 5y ago
    > Are you saying that if I ask an artist to make a painting for me and the painting get stolen AFTER they made it, I am allowed to not pay the artist? That’s not the situation being discussed. What you’re arguing is more along the lines that it’s okay to sneak into a concert because you don’t like the guy selling tickets.
    - peoplefromibiza 5y ago
      > What you’re arguing is more along the lines that it’s okay to sneak into a concert because you don’t like the guy selling tickets. Not at all. I'm arguing that you could listen to an unofficial bootleg if you don't like the guy selling tickets. If you want to help the band, you can buy their merch from the stand. If people working for large media companies had a merchandise stand, I would buy it, if I liked what they do. Most of my friends are artists, writers, comic writers, painters, musicians, director, actors etc. I've worked in the music business for a long time myself What my friends say is that people working for streaming services today have lost the status of artists, they are employee of those companies and are doing a job, it's the company's responsibility to pay their salaries, they are not interacting with the audience anymore, they are not gifting the World with their creations, they are making products. Just like coders who work at Adobe. Do they mind if someone installs a cracked copy of Photoshop? No, they do not. Why should they?

acdha 5y ago

> they are between a rock and a stone: accept to work for these platforms and get paid shit, while they nmake billion, or don't and get paid shit, but at least own your work. Guess which way many are starting to take... Again, I'm not saying that the current situation is great but if you were really concerned about artists being fairly compensated you would not take the action which results in them not getting paid. You could buy directly from the artist or you can go without, but taking advantage of their work without the agreed upon compensation calls your motives into question.

peoplefromibiza 5y ago
> Again, I'm not saying that the current situation is great but if you were really concerned about artists being fairly compensated you would not take the action which results in them not getting paid. Are you saying that if I ask an artist to make a painting for me and the painting get stolen AFTER they made it, I am allowed to not pay the artist? That's a really strange POV. Media companies should pay artists, not me. I am only paying for their services, not for the content, which I can get in many other ways or not get it at all, which is an option too, but by your logic not watching the content would lead to artists not getting paid so I should feel bad about that too... I am not the one monetizing artists' work and they are not doing it because I am paying, but because media companies hired them to do their job. Again: sorry, not sorry!
- acdha 5y ago
  > Are you saying that if I ask an artist to make a painting for me and the painting get stolen AFTER they made it, I am allowed to not pay the artist? That’s not the situation being discussed. What you’re arguing is more along the lines that it’s okay to sneak into a concert because you don’t like the guy selling tickets.
  - peoplefromibiza 5y ago
    > What you’re arguing is more along the lines that it’s okay to sneak into a concert because you don’t like the guy selling tickets. Not at all. I'm arguing that you could listen to an unofficial bootleg if you don't like the guy selling tickets. If you want to help the band, you can buy their merch from the stand. If people working for large media companies had a merchandise stand, I would buy it, if I liked what they do. Most of my friends are artists, writers, comic writers, painters, musicians, director, actors etc. I've worked in the music business for a long time myself What my friends say is that people working for streaming services today have lost the status of artists, they are employee of those companies and are doing a job, it's the company's responsibility to pay their salaries, they are not interacting with the audience anymore, they are not gifting the World with their creations, they are making products. Just like coders who work at Adobe. Do they mind if someone installs a cracked copy of Photoshop? No, they do not. Why should they?