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“Imagine your great grandparents saving their pennies to buy a nice set of doilys to pass down to you?” I’m not sure this is an appropriate metaphor. Partly b

“Imagine your great grandparents saving their pennies to buy a nice set of doilys to pass down to you?” I’m not sure this is an appropriate metaphor. Partly because a doily in your example is construed as an asset, whereas adaptation to climate (our bequest to our grandchildren) is a cost. Secondly because apportionment of the costs and benefits will not be equitable. In the west, we benefit disproportionately from burning fossil fuels, but it will be future people in developing states who disproportionately bear the costs. Thirdly, because the costs of climate change might run very high indeed. Look for reviews of Nordstrom’s climate economics to understand some of his appalling modeling assumptions.

bko 5y ago
Poor countries have benefited a lot more from industrialization over the last 50 years than wealthy countries. No matter the metric you look at, be it extreme poverty, food security, education, life expectancy etc. https://ourworldindata.org/a-history-of-global-living-conditions-in-5-charts?linkId=62571595 https://ourworldindata.org/a-history-of-global-living-condit...
- Biologist123 5y ago
  > Poor countries have benefited a lot more from industrialization over the last 50 years than wealthy countries. Wealthy countries had already industrialized. Poor countries were starting from a _very_ low base. They’re still a lot poorer and their contribution to historical emissions is small. Re the metrics you present, I agree against those things are much improved. But I sometimes wonder whether those metrics are very western centric, chosen by technocrats to make themselves look good. In the context of Maslow’s hierarchy of needs, I suspect people in many of these places are in a worse position than they were pre-colonialism. Particularly in terms of self-actualization. But on the other levels too. I say this as a former technocrat.
  - bko 5y ago
    If you don't agree with the metric pick another objective metric that could be measured. You would be hard pressed to find a metric in which developing countries have not considerably improved since industrialization.
    - Biologist123 5y ago
      1. Rights of access to productive assets. 2. Asset yield. 3. Leisure time.
      - bko 5y ago
        1. Composite indicator of financial market development. Developing countries saw a big jump from the 1990s in terms of access to capital markets (productive assets) [0] 2. this one is tied into #1. People in developing countries have more access to capital markets and therefore more access to higher yielding products 3. Average annual hours actually worked per worker (OECD) shows a downward trend among practically all countries [1] [0] https://voxeu.org/article/financial-market-development-economic-development https://voxeu.org/article/financial-market-development-econo... [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Working_time#/media/File:Annual_working_time_in_OECD.svg https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Working_time#/media/File:Annua...
        Biologist123 5y ago
        1. There is a difference between access and right of access; you’re mixing apples and pears. 2. As above. 3.Your time series starts in 1979 yet should start pre-colonialism, for it to be relevant to your point.

bko 5y ago

Poor countries have benefited a lot more from industrialization over the last 50 years than wealthy countries. No matter the metric you look at, be it extreme poverty, food security, education, life expectancy etc. https://ourworldindata.org/a-history-of-global-living-conditions-in-5-charts?linkId=62571595 https://ourworldindata.org/a-history-of-global-living-condit...

Biologist123 5y ago
> Poor countries have benefited a lot more from industrialization over the last 50 years than wealthy countries. Wealthy countries had already industrialized. Poor countries were starting from a _very_ low base. They’re still a lot poorer and their contribution to historical emissions is small. Re the metrics you present, I agree against those things are much improved. But I sometimes wonder whether those metrics are very western centric, chosen by technocrats to make themselves look good. In the context of Maslow’s hierarchy of needs, I suspect people in many of these places are in a worse position than they were pre-colonialism. Particularly in terms of self-actualization. But on the other levels too. I say this as a former technocrat.
- bko 5y ago
  If you don't agree with the metric pick another objective metric that could be measured. You would be hard pressed to find a metric in which developing countries have not considerably improved since industrialization.
  - Biologist123 5y ago
    1. Rights of access to productive assets. 2. Asset yield. 3. Leisure time.
    - bko 5y ago
      1. Composite indicator of financial market development. Developing countries saw a big jump from the 1990s in terms of access to capital markets (productive assets) [0] 2. this one is tied into #1. People in developing countries have more access to capital markets and therefore more access to higher yielding products 3. Average annual hours actually worked per worker (OECD) shows a downward trend among practically all countries [1] [0] https://voxeu.org/article/financial-market-development-economic-development https://voxeu.org/article/financial-market-development-econo... [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Working_time#/media/File:Annual_working_time_in_OECD.svg https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Working_time#/media/File:Annua...
      - Biologist123 5y ago
        1. There is a difference between access and right of access; you’re mixing apples and pears. 2. As above. 3.Your time series starts in 1979 yet should start pre-colonialism, for it to be relevant to your point.