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> It’s just unpopular to say as much online these days because the people who do prefer WFH are sensitive about any suggestions that it isn’t universally superi

> It’s just unpopular to say as much online these days because the people who do prefer WFH are sensitive about any suggestions that it isn’t universally superior. Maybe it's because people WFH don't care at all if you want to spend 2 hours commuting, or that you don't mind getting covid by staying 8h a day in a closed office with tons of people. But people who doesn't want WFH, not only want to be in a office, they also want the other people in the company at the office too, because otherwise "I worry I'm going to go in to the office and be the only one there".

chrsig 5y ago
This is the real crux. It's not that people who hate wfh want to be in the office, it's that people that hate wfh want me to be in the office. It's not that one's superior to the other, it's that one wants to force itself on the other.
- titanomachy 5y ago
  I don’t want to force anyone to do anything. I want to find a team that has the same primary work mode that I do: in-person collaboration. My current team has a loose agreement that this is how we’ll work after covid, but I just joined in the last year so we’ll see. If there are also teams (or whole companies) of people who work best over Zoom, then that’s great. Of course I can be flexible about things like covid variant surges or natural disasters.
  - tablespoonsruby 5y ago
    > I don’t want to force anyone to do anything. I want to find a team that has the same primary work mode that I do: in-person collaboration. I think of this the way I think of full-time pair programming: nobody should be forced to do it, but it's perfectly fine to form a team where it's a key part of the culture, as long as it's made abundantly clear to new hires before they join that it will be expected of them.
- scaryclam 5y ago
  To be fair, both want to force themselves on the other. Compromise is really important when considering how people work. The all-or-nothing attitude is unproductive and doesn't help either acheive their goals.
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]
- geekbird 5y ago
  That's what I've found: People who like being in the office and socializing want to force me to commute for several hours a day just so they can yak at me, disrupt my concentration, and "see" me work. No thank you. If the in-office people would just go into the office together and then deal with the remote people as we are, things would be fine. But no, the in-office extroverts want to force us all into their mold.
  - cmonagle 5y ago
    OP is, very explicitly, trying to find a workplace ith people who prefer being in the office. We could easily rework this kind of statement: > People who like working from home want to force me to spend hours on Zoom, and subject me to constant Slack interruptions, just so they never have to "see" me, or interact with me as a complete human. No thank you. > If the remote people would just work remotely, things would be fine. But no, when a single team member is remote, everyone has to adopt their preferred ersatz remote practices. Of course, this is silly, nobody is trying to force anyone into a work environment that they hate--why would I want my colleagues to be miserable ? I believe we'll end up self sorting, so everyone can be happy, and to that end there is absolutely nothing wrong with asking advice on how to find your preferred work environment, whether that's in office or remote.
deleted 5y ago
[deleted]
bryguy32403 5y ago
> the people who do prefer WFH are sensitive about any suggestions that it isn’t universally superior.
- severino 5y ago
  But I don't prefer WFH.
rsynnott 5y ago
I’m not sure that’s true; some people do get weirdly evangelical about WFH. Personally, I’m glad that people who like WFH have increased opportunities to do it now, so long as I never have to do it again myself. Worst two years of my life.
- thowaway202107 5y ago
  > I’m not sure that’s true; some people do get weirdly evangelical about WFH. I don’t think its evangelical as much as protective. I for one have had to endure grueling years of working in open office environments. I’ve got pretty severe adhd and anxiety, that’s not a good place for me. With covid, the world shifted to working how I prefer. I’m terrified it’ll go back to how it was. So I’m sorry it’s been a rough couple years for you, but please understand that it’s been a rough lifetime for people like me. Because office work is still the default mentality for most people, this new world that’s aligned to my needs is in constant jeopardy.
  - geekbird 5y ago
    Amen. If people like being in the office, fine. I don't understand it, but that's okay. I have ADHD and have a large startle reflex - I hate open plan offices, I dislike commuting, and I get more done from home. If the office people stop trying to force me into the office with them, we can get along. Otherwise, no. For once in my life I can work in an environment that works for me. I'm not going to let some extrovert ruin it if I can avoid it.
    - drstewart 5y ago
      This is a perfect example of an evangelical WFHer spamming threads trying to convert people

chrsig 5y ago

This is the real crux. It's not that people who hate wfh want to be in the office, it's that people that hate wfh want me to be in the office. It's not that one's superior to the other, it's that one wants to force itself on the other.

titanomachy 5y ago
I don’t want to force anyone to do anything. I want to find a team that has the same primary work mode that I do: in-person collaboration. My current team has a loose agreement that this is how we’ll work after covid, but I just joined in the last year so we’ll see. If there are also teams (or whole companies) of people who work best over Zoom, then that’s great. Of course I can be flexible about things like covid variant surges or natural disasters.
- tablespoonsruby 5y ago
  > I don’t want to force anyone to do anything. I want to find a team that has the same primary work mode that I do: in-person collaboration. I think of this the way I think of full-time pair programming: nobody should be forced to do it, but it's perfectly fine to form a team where it's a key part of the culture, as long as it's made abundantly clear to new hires before they join that it will be expected of them.
scaryclam 5y ago
To be fair, both want to force themselves on the other. Compromise is really important when considering how people work. The all-or-nothing attitude is unproductive and doesn't help either acheive their goals.
deleted 5y ago
[deleted]
geekbird 5y ago
That's what I've found: People who like being in the office and socializing want to force me to commute for several hours a day just so they can yak at me, disrupt my concentration, and "see" me work. No thank you. If the in-office people would just go into the office together and then deal with the remote people as we are, things would be fine. But no, the in-office extroverts want to force us all into their mold.
- cmonagle 5y ago
  OP is, very explicitly, trying to find a workplace ith people who prefer being in the office. We could easily rework this kind of statement: > People who like working from home want to force me to spend hours on Zoom, and subject me to constant Slack interruptions, just so they never have to "see" me, or interact with me as a complete human. No thank you. > If the remote people would just work remotely, things would be fine. But no, when a single team member is remote, everyone has to adopt their preferred ersatz remote practices. Of course, this is silly, nobody is trying to force anyone into a work environment that they hate--why would I want my colleagues to be miserable ? I believe we'll end up self sorting, so everyone can be happy, and to that end there is absolutely nothing wrong with asking advice on how to find your preferred work environment, whether that's in office or remote.

deleted 5y ago

[deleted]

bryguy32403 5y ago

> the people who do prefer WFH are sensitive about any suggestions that it isn’t universally superior.

severino 5y ago
But I don't prefer WFH.

rsynnott 5y ago

I’m not sure that’s true; some people do get weirdly evangelical about WFH. Personally, I’m glad that people who like WFH have increased opportunities to do it now, so long as I never have to do it again myself. Worst two years of my life.

thowaway202107 5y ago
> I’m not sure that’s true; some people do get weirdly evangelical about WFH. I don’t think its evangelical as much as protective. I for one have had to endure grueling years of working in open office environments. I’ve got pretty severe adhd and anxiety, that’s not a good place for me. With covid, the world shifted to working how I prefer. I’m terrified it’ll go back to how it was. So I’m sorry it’s been a rough couple years for you, but please understand that it’s been a rough lifetime for people like me. Because office work is still the default mentality for most people, this new world that’s aligned to my needs is in constant jeopardy.
- geekbird 5y ago
  Amen. If people like being in the office, fine. I don't understand it, but that's okay. I have ADHD and have a large startle reflex - I hate open plan offices, I dislike commuting, and I get more done from home. If the office people stop trying to force me into the office with them, we can get along. Otherwise, no. For once in my life I can work in an environment that works for me. I'm not going to let some extrovert ruin it if I can avoid it.
  - drstewart 5y ago
    This is a perfect example of an evangelical WFHer spamming threads trying to convert people