5 ms·

If we want to save the planet, the future of food is insects

mytailorisrich 5y ago
All these discussions try to solve feeding more humans, which is a secondary issue and the consequence of the primary issue: more humans resulting in an unsustainable number of humans on the planet.
coldtea 5y ago
No, it's just a solution - that nobody asked for - looking for a problem. It's also the food industry looking for a new profitable market, and PRing the crap out of it, with BS articles - the same appearing all the time, for 3+ decades, until they finally get it to stick...
usrbinbash 5y ago
No it isn't. We already have an economically efficient food source. It's called plants. And if we stopped wasting 25kg of edible produce (like soy) to make 1kg of beef, and cared more about effective distribution and solving logistic problems than pleasing the stock market, we could easily feed the the worlds population without dooming our planet. Insects are a viable addition, as they are capable of converting otherwise inedible plant material into material fit for human consumption. But they are not required.
- cheese_goddess 5y ago
  So, I have a question, I don't know if you can answer it, but in conversations like this one people always bring up beef. My question is: why? Most of the meat production globally is pork and chicken. In 2018, beef production was about 20% of all meat production while pork and chicken combined was about 70%: https://ourworldindata.org/meat-production#meat-production-by-animal https://ourworldindata.org/meat-production#meat-production-b... Most of the meat people eat (not just production) is also pork and chicken again with about 20% beef and 70% pork and chicken: https://ourworldindata.org/meat-production#what-types-of-meat-do-people-eat https://ourworldindata.org/meat-production#what-types-of-mea... So why the focus on beef? Can you explain? Btw, note that I don't agree (or disagree) with the article about insects being any kind of solution to anything so my question has nothing to do with the article.
  - usrbinbash 5y ago
    > So why the focus on beef? Can you explain? To make a stronger argument. Beef production is by far the most inefficient method of converting resources (feed, water, land, energy) into meat, so its the one commonly used when argueing about resource requirements. One could say it's a rethorical tactic. Taking water as an example, the required amounts (litres) for 1kg of meat are: (beef:~15500, mutton:~10500, pork:~6000, chicken:~4300) However, the arguments would still work if we took chicken as the measurement...1kg of insect protein requires 5l of water, 3 orders of magnitude less than the most efficent classic meat production
LinuxBender 5y ago
Insects are not a solution despite already being used today. Strawberry flavored ice-cream anyone? Yeah that's beetles. And some peptides from insects are used in modern medicine. But willingly switch from energy dense meats to insects? Not until there are no other options and even then the insect option will be short lived when we that far into trouble. Insects may be in a distant dystopian future where governments/people paralyze themselves into inaction and don't act to improve water storage and delivery. Even then it would be a short term solution because when the water is gone, the people are gone shortly thereafter. Hopefully it doesn't come to that. Even if one believes insects would save the environment there would have to be peer reviewed studies done to show the environmental differences when we are talking about the scale of insect farms required to feed a nation or world. A few insect farms are not going to have the same impact as replacing all meat farms with the size and quantity of insect farms to meet the caloric and amino-acid replacement requirements. That is something else that would need many studies of course. Vitamin, mineral, collagen and other proteins, specific EAA/BCAA amino-acid profiles, and quantity of insects required to meet those replacement needs. Not all proteins are equal in protein and fat content. Fat is required to release bile from the gallbladder. This means finding the right balance of insects to get enough fat for bile release to break down proteins. Fat is highly variable in different species of insects. Insects would be introducing new bacterium into the human gut biome. Scientists are barely beginning to understand the gut-brain axis what what bacterium have what downstream effects. Some cultures already consume supplemental insects but their gut biome have evolved over a long period to handle this. There would also need to be studies on the impact to the endocrine and immune systems. Some people may have allergic and auto-immune reactions to specific bugs. There may be changes to hormone levels, positive or negative. Will the food packaging list the specific insects and quantity of each insect? From the hygienic point of view it should be pointed out that some insects may produce or contain toxic bioactive compounds. Each insect would need a toxicity profile and/or those toxins would need to be isolated and removed from the final product. Then there is the risk of cross contamination of insect farms and vegetable crop farms. Putting certain insects near crops in large amounts are a high risk to those farm owners. There would need to be regulations to prevent insect swarms escaping and destroying crops in their migratory path. Insects must not be introduced into a state that primarily contains farms with the foods those insects would consume.
adxl 5y ago
https://askabiologist.asu.edu/explore/life-and-death-fig-wasp https://askabiologist.asu.edu/explore/life-and-death-fig-was... You probably already eat bugs, just saying.
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]

All these discussions try to solve feeding more humans, which is a secondary issue and the consequence of the primary issue: more humans resulting in an unsustainable number of humans on the planet.

coldtea 5y ago

No, it's just a solution - that nobody asked for - looking for a problem. It's also the food industry looking for a new profitable market, and PRing the crap out of it, with BS articles - the same appearing all the time, for 3+ decades, until they finally get it to stick...

usrbinbash 5y ago

No it isn't. We already have an economically efficient food source. It's called plants. And if we stopped wasting 25kg of edible produce (like soy) to make 1kg of beef, and cared more about effective distribution and solving logistic problems than pleasing the stock market, we could easily feed the the worlds population without dooming our planet. Insects are a viable addition, as they are capable of converting otherwise inedible plant material into material fit for human consumption. But they are not required.

cheese_goddess 5y ago
So, I have a question, I don't know if you can answer it, but in conversations like this one people always bring up beef. My question is: why? Most of the meat production globally is pork and chicken. In 2018, beef production was about 20% of all meat production while pork and chicken combined was about 70%: https://ourworldindata.org/meat-production#meat-production-by-animal https://ourworldindata.org/meat-production#meat-production-b... Most of the meat people eat (not just production) is also pork and chicken again with about 20% beef and 70% pork and chicken: https://ourworldindata.org/meat-production#what-types-of-meat-do-people-eat https://ourworldindata.org/meat-production#what-types-of-mea... So why the focus on beef? Can you explain? Btw, note that I don't agree (or disagree) with the article about insects being any kind of solution to anything so my question has nothing to do with the article.
- usrbinbash 5y ago
  > So why the focus on beef? Can you explain? To make a stronger argument. Beef production is by far the most inefficient method of converting resources (feed, water, land, energy) into meat, so its the one commonly used when argueing about resource requirements. One could say it's a rethorical tactic. Taking water as an example, the required amounts (litres) for 1kg of meat are: (beef:~15500, mutton:~10500, pork:~6000, chicken:~4300) However, the arguments would still work if we took chicken as the measurement...1kg of insect protein requires 5l of water, 3 orders of magnitude less than the most efficent classic meat production

LinuxBender 5y ago

Insects are not a solution despite already being used today. Strawberry flavored ice-cream anyone? Yeah that's beetles. And some peptides from insects are used in modern medicine. But willingly switch from energy dense meats to insects? Not until there are no other options and even then the insect option will be short lived when we that far into trouble. Insects may be in a distant dystopian future where governments/people paralyze themselves into inaction and don't act to improve water storage and delivery. Even then it would be a short term solution because when the water is gone, the people are gone shortly thereafter. Hopefully it doesn't come to that. Even if one believes insects would save the environment there would have to be peer reviewed studies done to show the environmental differences when we are talking about the scale of insect farms required to feed a nation or world. A few insect farms are not going to have the same impact as replacing all meat farms with the size and quantity of insect farms to meet the caloric and amino-acid replacement requirements. That is something else that would need many studies of course. Vitamin, mineral, collagen and other proteins, specific EAA/BCAA amino-acid profiles, and quantity of insects required to meet those replacement needs. Not all proteins are equal in protein and fat content. Fat is required to release bile from the gallbladder. This means finding the right balance of insects to get enough fat for bile release to break down proteins. Fat is highly variable in different species of insects. Insects would be introducing new bacterium into the human gut biome. Scientists are barely beginning to understand the gut-brain axis what what bacterium have what downstream effects. Some cultures already consume supplemental insects but their gut biome have evolved over a long period to handle this. There would also need to be studies on the impact to the endocrine and immune systems. Some people may have allergic and auto-immune reactions to specific bugs. There may be changes to hormone levels, positive or negative. Will the food packaging list the specific insects and quantity of each insect? From the hygienic point of view it should be pointed out that some insects may produce or contain toxic bioactive compounds. Each insect would need a toxicity profile and/or those toxins would need to be isolated and removed from the final product. Then there is the risk of cross contamination of insect farms and vegetable crop farms. Putting certain insects near crops in large amounts are a high risk to those farm owners. There would need to be regulations to prevent insect swarms escaping and destroying crops in their migratory path. Insects must not be introduced into a state that primarily contains farms with the foods those insects would consume.

adxl 5y ago

https://askabiologist.asu.edu/explore/life-and-death-fig-wasp https://askabiologist.asu.edu/explore/life-and-death-fig-was... You probably already eat bugs, just saying.

deleted 5y ago
[deleted]