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I’m not convinced of the utility of lists like this, or the multitude of other Awesome JavaScript Yeahhhh!!! lists. As one of the issues in the GitHub reposito

I’m not convinced of the utility of lists like this, or the multitude of other Awesome JavaScript Yeahhhh!!! lists. As one of the issues in the GitHub repository suggest, it seems all that is needed for a book to be considered “mind expanding” here is for it to have a Goodreads and/or Amazon rating higher than 4. But what does that prove? There are people who rate Netflix’s Red Notice 10/10. Relative to those people, I think I’ve seen more intelligent forms of life swimming in the milk in my breakfast cereal. I read half of The Compound Effect — one of the books in this list. It was trash. I’ve also read Sapiens from this list, and I certainly would characterise it as mind expanding. Even from these two titles alone, I’d say the quality in the selection is far too variable. I think reviews are near enough useless unless you’re intimately familiar with the reviewer, and trying to curate the works in a collection like this by writing unit tests is probably futile.

waltbosz 5y ago
I'm on an Asimov binge right now. Just finished Foundation and Earth. So I jumped to the scifi section of the list and saw Ready Player One on there. I found that book mildly entertaining, but not a work of great literature, and certainly not mind expanding. I agree with your sentiment about the importance of knowing the reviewer. I think using general popularity as a gauge is a good way to get the worst recommendations.
- vinni2 5y ago
  > I think using general popularity as a gauge is a good way to get the worst recommendations. Do you know a better way to get good recommendations? I am genuinely interested.
  - waltbosz 5y ago
    I've had success looking up the book recommendation lists of people who I think are intelligent. For example, Bill Gates publishes a list of recommended reading. I know that Bill Gates isn't the sort of person who would waste his time reading crappy books. And even if he did, he would not waste his reputation recommending them to others. I'm not saying go read the books on his list (I have not). I'm just using him as a concrete example of smart people who recommend books. To find recommendations for yourself: Think of a person that you respect. Then google "{name} book recommendations" That should get you some hits. It's quite possible that if the person you respect is not too famous and busy, you could email them and ask for a recommendation. # Regarding popularity I can't speak with any actual authority on the matter of general popularity being a poor gauge other than my own observations that I've never been a fan of what is popular. I suspect that there are several people like me in that regard on this forum.
  - ngr 5y ago
    Talk about books with people you admire. My best reads came from recommendations by mentors, managers and friends. A quick message on LinkedIn is often enough to get a solid recommendation. Generally it seems people like being asked for that kind of advice.
  - azalemeth 5y ago
    If you want to learn a non-fiction subject, university reading lists are a great place to start. It's a very different experience reading a textbook when you don't have to take an exam -- or even re-reading one that you read when you did. For me, the dry wit of the authors comes out more and you can focus on stuff that really interests you. The other nice thing about this approach is that some textbooks are commonly recommended by different universities for the same courses -- and they're more likely to be good. For some random examples, Horrowitz and Hill, the art of electronics (for electronics!); Riley Hobson and Bence: mathematical methods for the physical sciences (for vector calculus); or David Mackay's book on information theory (legally freely available online, published by CUP and contains lots of Bayesian stuff the average HN reader would probably love).
- plafl 5y ago
  There was a time where Amazon was great to explore books: "users who bought also bought". Good old collaborative filtering. I feel bad for giving useless advice so as someone who read several times the whole foundation series as a teen may I suggest: A deepness in the sky, a fire upon the deep, the forever war, gateway (Frederick Pohl). If you like fantasy, or even if not: the blade itself. If you have an enemy recommend him/her "the name of the wind". It's a great book but it's the first of an unfinished trilogy. Edit: how could I forget the cryptonomicon?
  - cdubzzz 5y ago
    I’m currently working my way through the Hugo award winners and am in the time of The Forever War and Gateway. I also recommend them for the most part. Rendezvous with Rama around that time is also really enjoyable.
  - korla 5y ago
    I still recommend Name of the Wind. It's frustrating, but I would rather have loved and lost, than not loved at all.
stunt 5y ago
I once asked a bunch of my colleagues if they ever used one of these awesome lists and their answer was no. I asked the same group if they bookmarked, stared, or shared an awesome list before, and more than half of them said yes. Whatever that means.
- dkdbejwi383 5y ago
  It’s the developer equivalent of inane and/or factually incorrect chain emails from older relatives
- noiwillnot 5y ago
  I am actually the other way around. I use them as one data point to find new libraries in fields I have never worked in. They tend to be incomplete and no curation at all. But still useful.
- kaoD 5y ago
  Counterpoint here: I recently used awesome-gbdev[0] and found it fantastic. Not starred or bookmarked though! [0] https://github.com/gbdev/awesome-gbdev https://github.com/gbdev/awesome-gbdev
alfiedotwtf 5y ago
We need a Netflix Prize but for books!
gexla 5y ago
I find Goodreads to be a great place to find books from the reviews. Generally you'll see at least one review which looks compelling. Usually what I'm looking for is not a book target, but rather an on-ramp for the path to find the target. Often reviews lead to a key list of works for the subject you're looking for. Then you know you have found one of those keys when the reviews recognize the book as such and stop recommending other books. Though they will recommend similar texts which might be more accessible. Aside from Goodreads reviews, you could do similar through tracing a path of sources from the book (if you can find the sources for it.) Maybe do both.
hooande 5y ago
This list is a great starting point. I have enough judgement to discern between books that are worth my time and books that aren't. Personally, I'm going to scan these titles and look up things that I don't recognize on Amazon and Wikipedia. At no point did I consider reading every book sequentially because of blind trust in a github list. I take the same approach with any of the "Awesome" lists. They're meant to be used for overview and familiarization, not rote adoption.
stared 5y ago
I agree. Most of the best non-fiction books I've read don't have a 4.5 Goodreads score. They spark some controversy (many people expect to agree on a book they read), or they are not for everyone (topic-wise, level-wise, etc). It works the same for everything (movies, food). E.g. the best average score for movies is for the best average movies. Unless it is so niched that it is only read by people deep into a subject (again, then a high score says little about general quality). But even for the >4.0-rated books, I find the collection bizarre. E.g. "Metaphors We Live By" is here somewhere in the middle (at least got 4.08), while for me, it is the single most insightful book about human language as a way of thinking. "Realms of the Human Unconscious: Observations from LSD Research" by Stanislav Grof (4.34), a book that unifies & classifies psychedelic experiences (going beyond "good vs bad trip"), religious experiences, and CPTSD - is not even on the list. But sure - this book is not that popular. Yet, "Consciousness Explained" by Daniel Dennett (3.88) is not even on the list - just to name a few. So instead of pretending that it is some collection of "mind-expanding books", let's make it "Favourite books of hackerkid", assuming they read them. If not, then "a random collection of vaguely mind-expanding books".

waltbosz 5y ago

I'm on an Asimov binge right now. Just finished Foundation and Earth. So I jumped to the scifi section of the list and saw Ready Player One on there. I found that book mildly entertaining, but not a work of great literature, and certainly not mind expanding. I agree with your sentiment about the importance of knowing the reviewer. I think using general popularity as a gauge is a good way to get the worst recommendations.

vinni2 5y ago
> I think using general popularity as a gauge is a good way to get the worst recommendations. Do you know a better way to get good recommendations? I am genuinely interested.
- waltbosz 5y ago
  I've had success looking up the book recommendation lists of people who I think are intelligent. For example, Bill Gates publishes a list of recommended reading. I know that Bill Gates isn't the sort of person who would waste his time reading crappy books. And even if he did, he would not waste his reputation recommending them to others. I'm not saying go read the books on his list (I have not). I'm just using him as a concrete example of smart people who recommend books. To find recommendations for yourself: Think of a person that you respect. Then google "{name} book recommendations" That should get you some hits. It's quite possible that if the person you respect is not too famous and busy, you could email them and ask for a recommendation. # Regarding popularity I can't speak with any actual authority on the matter of general popularity being a poor gauge other than my own observations that I've never been a fan of what is popular. I suspect that there are several people like me in that regard on this forum.
- ngr 5y ago
  Talk about books with people you admire. My best reads came from recommendations by mentors, managers and friends. A quick message on LinkedIn is often enough to get a solid recommendation. Generally it seems people like being asked for that kind of advice.
- azalemeth 5y ago
  If you want to learn a non-fiction subject, university reading lists are a great place to start. It's a very different experience reading a textbook when you don't have to take an exam -- or even re-reading one that you read when you did. For me, the dry wit of the authors comes out more and you can focus on stuff that really interests you. The other nice thing about this approach is that some textbooks are commonly recommended by different universities for the same courses -- and they're more likely to be good. For some random examples, Horrowitz and Hill, the art of electronics (for electronics!); Riley Hobson and Bence: mathematical methods for the physical sciences (for vector calculus); or David Mackay's book on information theory (legally freely available online, published by CUP and contains lots of Bayesian stuff the average HN reader would probably love).
plafl 5y ago
There was a time where Amazon was great to explore books: "users who bought also bought". Good old collaborative filtering. I feel bad for giving useless advice so as someone who read several times the whole foundation series as a teen may I suggest: A deepness in the sky, a fire upon the deep, the forever war, gateway (Frederick Pohl). If you like fantasy, or even if not: the blade itself. If you have an enemy recommend him/her "the name of the wind". It's a great book but it's the first of an unfinished trilogy. Edit: how could I forget the cryptonomicon?
- cdubzzz 5y ago
  I’m currently working my way through the Hugo award winners and am in the time of The Forever War and Gateway. I also recommend them for the most part. Rendezvous with Rama around that time is also really enjoyable.
- korla 5y ago
  I still recommend Name of the Wind. It's frustrating, but I would rather have loved and lost, than not loved at all.

stunt 5y ago

I once asked a bunch of my colleagues if they ever used one of these awesome lists and their answer was no. I asked the same group if they bookmarked, stared, or shared an awesome list before, and more than half of them said yes. Whatever that means.

dkdbejwi383 5y ago
It’s the developer equivalent of inane and/or factually incorrect chain emails from older relatives
noiwillnot 5y ago
I am actually the other way around. I use them as one data point to find new libraries in fields I have never worked in. They tend to be incomplete and no curation at all. But still useful.
kaoD 5y ago
Counterpoint here: I recently used awesome-gbdev[0] and found it fantastic. Not starred or bookmarked though! [0] https://github.com/gbdev/awesome-gbdev https://github.com/gbdev/awesome-gbdev

alfiedotwtf 5y ago

We need a Netflix Prize but for books!

gexla 5y ago

I find Goodreads to be a great place to find books from the reviews. Generally you'll see at least one review which looks compelling. Usually what I'm looking for is not a book target, but rather an on-ramp for the path to find the target. Often reviews lead to a key list of works for the subject you're looking for. Then you know you have found one of those keys when the reviews recognize the book as such and stop recommending other books. Though they will recommend similar texts which might be more accessible. Aside from Goodreads reviews, you could do similar through tracing a path of sources from the book (if you can find the sources for it.) Maybe do both.

hooande 5y ago

This list is a great starting point. I have enough judgement to discern between books that are worth my time and books that aren't. Personally, I'm going to scan these titles and look up things that I don't recognize on Amazon and Wikipedia. At no point did I consider reading every book sequentially because of blind trust in a github list. I take the same approach with any of the "Awesome" lists. They're meant to be used for overview and familiarization, not rote adoption.

stared 5y ago

I agree. Most of the best non-fiction books I've read don't have a 4.5 Goodreads score. They spark some controversy (many people expect to agree on a book they read), or they are not for everyone (topic-wise, level-wise, etc). It works the same for everything (movies, food). E.g. the best average score for movies is for the best average movies. Unless it is so niched that it is only read by people deep into a subject (again, then a high score says little about general quality). But even for the >4.0-rated books, I find the collection bizarre. E.g. "Metaphors We Live By" is here somewhere in the middle (at least got 4.08), while for me, it is the single most insightful book about human language as a way of thinking. "Realms of the Human Unconscious: Observations from LSD Research" by Stanislav Grof (4.34), a book that unifies & classifies psychedelic experiences (going beyond "good vs bad trip"), religious experiences, and CPTSD - is not even on the list. But sure - this book is not that popular. Yet, "Consciousness Explained" by Daniel Dennett (3.88) is not even on the list - just to name a few. So instead of pretending that it is some collection of "mind-expanding books", let's make it "Favourite books of hackerkid", assuming they read them. If not, then "a random collection of vaguely mind-expanding books".