3 ms·

“God hating atheists” don’t hate the actual God, it doesn’t exist. The hate is directed toward the concept of god, which is definitely real.

by yibg 5y ago

aristofun 5y ago
But what's actual difference between God and concept of God? This is rethorical question, 'cause there is no easy answer, and yet my original statement is valid. In this case god-hating atheists confirm the existence of god in the form of 'concept' you may say.
- yibg 5y ago
  I don't really understand, seems like there is a very easy answer. In the case of belief I would've thought that's obvious. I can be afraid of zombies without believing zombies exist. I don't think anyone denies the existence of the concept of god. I'm an atheist, but of course the concept of god exists. People believe in it, it can and has been talked about. Seems like you're equating the concept of god (i.e. people's beliefs), with the actual entity of God (i.e. the man in the sky that created everything).
- alecbz 5y ago
  > In this case god-hating atheists confirm the existence of god in the form of 'concept' you may say. C'mon, no atheist is remotely claiming that God doesn't exist even as a concept. You can't possibly think this is what any atheist ever meant? On the face of it it's almost impossible to claim that something doesn't exist as a concept, since making such a claim creates the concept. Some atheists might claim there are logical inconsistencies in the concept of God, but that's still different from claiming the concept doesn't exist.
  - aristofun 5y ago
    > C'mon, no atheist is remotely claiming that God doesn't exist even as a concept. You can't possibly think this is what any atheist ever meant? Personally I don’t care neither abou atheists nor about religious people in general. I was just answering the question.
    - alecbz 5y ago
      > I was just answering the question. But you misinterpreted what "exists" means in this context.
      - aristofun 5y ago
        And what does it mean exactly?
        alecbz 5y ago
        Existing in a more tangible sense, not existing as a concept.
        aristofun 5y ago
        Okay, and why exactly existing as a concept is less important for this argument? Additional question — what religions do you know that explicitly state the existence of god in materialistic sense and not as a non tangible ideal (hence the word idea by the way)? Please try to answer deeply and not just critisize me for hating atheists, I am not, I just point out very simple but overlooked details that are crucial for such discussions.
- dragonwriter 5y ago
  > In this case god-hating atheists confirm the existence of god in the form of ‘concept’ you may say. The existence of a concept is not the same thing as the existence of the thing the concept refers to.
  - aristofun 5y ago
    > The existence of a concept is not the same thing as the existence of the thing the concept refers to. Yes it is, for most of the average Joe believers the concept of god is the god, since they never faced any other kind of god in their life. The same with zombies - if you afraid of them => they definitely exist _at least_ in your head! Otherwise what the hell exactly are you afraid of?
    - dragonwriter 5y ago
      > > > The existence of a concept is not the same thing as the existence of the thing the concept refers to. > Yes it is No, it's not. > for most of the average Joe believers the concept of god is the god, since they never faced any other kind of god in their life. This...requires the assumption that God does not exist (in re, if we must, since you seem to insist on the archaic, Anselm-like insistence that existence in intellectu is a real thing and that material existence is a predicate), but, even ignoring that giant problem with one premise, that's not true. I may have a concept of a robber who robbed my house when no such robbery actually occurred in the material universe, but the existence of they concept doesn't mean that a robber who robbed my house exists even if I have had no experience of a material robber only the concept, it means the concept refers to a thing that does not exist. Ditto with concepts of God to the extent that God does not exist.
      - aristofun 5y ago
        So what? You still can’t hate the robber if he doesn’t exist at least in your imagination, right?

“God hating atheists” don’t hate the actual God, it doesn’t exist. The hate is directed toward the concept of god, which is definitely real.

by yibg 5y ago

“God hating atheists” don’t hate the actual God, it doesn’t exist. The hate is directed toward the concept of god, which is definitely real.

aristofun 5y ago

But what's actual difference between God and concept of God? This is rethorical question, 'cause there is no easy answer, and yet my original statement is valid. In this case god-hating atheists confirm the existence of god in the form of 'concept' you may say.

yibg 5y ago
I don't really understand, seems like there is a very easy answer. In the case of belief I would've thought that's obvious. I can be afraid of zombies without believing zombies exist. I don't think anyone denies the existence of the concept of god. I'm an atheist, but of course the concept of god exists. People believe in it, it can and has been talked about. Seems like you're equating the concept of god (i.e. people's beliefs), with the actual entity of God (i.e. the man in the sky that created everything).
alecbz 5y ago
> In this case god-hating atheists confirm the existence of god in the form of 'concept' you may say. C'mon, no atheist is remotely claiming that God doesn't exist even as a concept. You can't possibly think this is what any atheist ever meant? On the face of it it's almost impossible to claim that something doesn't exist as a concept, since making such a claim creates the concept. Some atheists might claim there are logical inconsistencies in the concept of God, but that's still different from claiming the concept doesn't exist.
- aristofun 5y ago
  > C'mon, no atheist is remotely claiming that God doesn't exist even as a concept. You can't possibly think this is what any atheist ever meant? Personally I don’t care neither abou atheists nor about religious people in general. I was just answering the question.
  - alecbz 5y ago
    > I was just answering the question. But you misinterpreted what "exists" means in this context.
    - aristofun 5y ago
      And what does it mean exactly?
      - alecbz 5y ago
        Existing in a more tangible sense, not existing as a concept.
        aristofun 5y ago
        Okay, and why exactly existing as a concept is less important for this argument? Additional question — what religions do you know that explicitly state the existence of god in materialistic sense and not as a non tangible ideal (hence the word idea by the way)? Please try to answer deeply and not just critisize me for hating atheists, I am not, I just point out very simple but overlooked details that are crucial for such discussions.
dragonwriter 5y ago
> In this case god-hating atheists confirm the existence of god in the form of ‘concept’ you may say. The existence of a concept is not the same thing as the existence of the thing the concept refers to.
- aristofun 5y ago
  > The existence of a concept is not the same thing as the existence of the thing the concept refers to. Yes it is, for most of the average Joe believers the concept of god is the god, since they never faced any other kind of god in their life. The same with zombies - if you afraid of them => they definitely exist _at least_ in your head! Otherwise what the hell exactly are you afraid of?
  - dragonwriter 5y ago
    > > > The existence of a concept is not the same thing as the existence of the thing the concept refers to. > Yes it is No, it's not. > for most of the average Joe believers the concept of god is the god, since they never faced any other kind of god in their life. This...requires the assumption that God does not exist (in re, if we must, since you seem to insist on the archaic, Anselm-like insistence that existence in intellectu is a real thing and that material existence is a predicate), but, even ignoring that giant problem with one premise, that's not true. I may have a concept of a robber who robbed my house when no such robbery actually occurred in the material universe, but the existence of they concept doesn't mean that a robber who robbed my house exists even if I have had no experience of a material robber only the concept, it means the concept refers to a thing that does not exist. Ditto with concepts of God to the extent that God does not exist.
    - aristofun 5y ago
      So what? You still can’t hate the robber if he doesn’t exist at least in your imagination, right?