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These are games we're talking about. They're recreation. For people to be demanding legislation because a recreational activity isn't set up just the way they l
by pdonis 5y ago
These are games we're talking about. They're recreation. For people to be demanding legislation because a recreational activity isn't set up just the way they like it, when they knew the terms perfectly well before they paid their money, is not "participating in cultural works".
- boondaburrah 5y agohow is recreation not part of culture?
- endisneigh 5y agoYou're entirely missing the point of the comment if you think it's about games. It's about digital goods.
- pdonis 5y agoI can't think of any "digital good" where there is a risk of losing access in this way that isn't recreational in a similar way to games. So my comments would apply equally well to any such goods.
- josephcsible 5y agoTwo that immediately come to mind are online textbooks and Adobe Creative Cloud.
- pdonis 5y agoHm. I agree online textbooks are different because you're not just paying for the textbook, you're also paying a school tuition, and the school isn't going to refund your tuition just because the textbook provider made a mistake. I asked another poster just upthread about the software (such as Creative Cloud) case.
- conradludgate 5y agoYou can buy text books outside of school. Let's say I buy some OReilly or Manning e-books, and then they take them away from me. Whereas the physical copy for just a little bit extra remains mine for as long as the copy stays readable (centuries if given care)
- endisneigh 5y agoYou're on a forum called "Hacker News" and you can't think of a single digital good that's not recreational? In any case the biggest examples would be software.
- pdonis 5y agoAre there any examples of software providers revoking access in this way? (I personally have no experience with such things because I will never use or pay for software that is provided in this way.)
- southerntofu 5y agoWith service providers (eg. Google/Facebook) it happens every day to thousands of people, and there's little to no recourse although there was usually no financial transaction to begin with. With software you setup on your computer, i'm not aware of any instance, BUT subscription models (eg. Adobe) are really recent and not so long ago software vendors did not have the means to disable software remotely on your machine, because it was usually not (always) connected to the network, and because software that didn't need it didn't make useless network connections. I bet in a few years we'll have plenty of documented instances.
- boring_twenties 5y agoKindle books?
- pdonis 5y agoThose are recreation. (Except for edge cases like online textbooks, which another poster just upthread mentioned.)
- conradludgate 5y agoWhy should recreational works not be protected? Isn't enjoying artwork purely recreational, except we put a greater deal of care into preserving and displaying the historical works. A lot of games fall into the same categories of digital interactive art. Especially if its mostly a single player game, I may want to re-experience that game later, much like I might watch a DVD or VHS I still own from my childhood. Of course I wouldn't expect their servers to still be running, which is why getting rid of DRM is important for the sake of archival
- lobocinza 5y agoI'm glad that people worry about preserving all forms of cultural works but I personally attribute a lesser value to games, cinema and TV. Keep in mind that players leave long before servers stop working. To me games are more of medium than an object and the artifacts left behind like stories, wikis, screenshots, videos and memes are of a higher importance and also easier to preserve. Let's say that you don't need to have a running Coliseum to understand how it works and it's societal implications. Also most of what I see in games and movies are things originated or preserved long ago in books. And what games and movies do is summarize things and add action scenes and emotional filler.