5 ms·

Where are people asked to feel guilty specifically about the fact they received a good education?

by malnourish 5y ago

cpursley 5y ago
For similar reasons they're supposed to feel guilty for being born into a particular race.
- borski 5y ago
  You are equating guilt with acknowledging privilege, and those aren’t the same. I feel privileged for having gone to MIT, and acknowledge that privilege. I feel privileged for having grown up Jewish and white-appearing, and acknowledge that. I feel guilty for neither, and acknowledging that particular privilege takes nothing away from how hard I worked anyway. The son of two very poor Russian Jewish immigrants, I worked extremely hard to get to where I am. I also feel privileged for growing up in a loving and non-abusive family. Lots of people don’t have those things, and I’m thankful I did. That’s not guilt.
  - notreallyserio 5y ago
    > You are equating guilt with acknowledging privilege, and those aren’t the same. This is one of those fundamental misunderstandings I see when discussing things with folks of a particular political persuasion. It's the same folks that belueve we shouldn't consider outcomes when evaluating processes. There's just something different about the way they think, I guess.
  - deleted 5y ago
    [deleted]
  - anamax 5y ago
    > You are equating guilt with acknowledging privilege, and those aren’t the same. When someone says "check your privilege", they're saying that you've done something wrong and should feel guilty.
    - borski 5y ago
      No, they aren’t. They are saying you should consider if and how your privilege helped you out, because sometimes that isn’t transferable to other people; someone black in a job interview may not have the same experience someone white does, and that’s okay, but it’s important to recognize if and how being white helped so that someone who isn’t white can account for that and adjust. It has nothing at all to do with guilt.
      - DangitBobby 5y ago
        It does have something to do with guilt, because the ultimate concession of acknowledging privilege is that you didn't truly earn your advantages, which is a root cause of perpetuated injustice. That's where the guilt lives: being the beneficiary of systematic injustice. This doesn't make you a bad person, of course; pretty much anyone in a position of privilege will capatalize on it, as that is human nature.
        borski 5y ago
        Acknowledging privilege doesn’t imply you didn’t earn your advantages; it implies there were some that were handed to you. Plenty of others need to be earned. It is rare, extremely rare, to meet someone with absolutely no privilege, and that isn’t a place to aspire to.
      - anamax 5y ago
        > They are saying you should consider if and how your privilege helped you out Yes, they are. "Check your privilege" is often used to say "you didn't do that." Even if you assume that "privilege" is a big reason why you had an opportunity, there are almost always many people with the same "privilege" who didn't do said thing. Moreover, it's almost always some skin color argument. There are many "don't look white" people who had privileges that I didn't have but I'm supposed to "check my privilege."
        borski 5y ago
        The idea is simply to acknowledge where your privilege helped you, and how others may not have had the same experiences or ease of access to certain things, etc. The trope of “he’s black and rich, and I’m white and poor” is irrelevant, as there are different kinds of privilege. In rural Alabama, being white and poor is going to lend you a much closer set of relationships than being black and rich. In SF, it may be the other way around - the point is everyone should simply be aware of how various privilege has helped them. And again: this takes nothing away from hard work. It simply acknowledges that another person who worked just as hard but had a different set of lived experiences and privileges may not have the same result. That’s not bad; just fact. And again: it has nothing to do with guilt. You shouldn’t feel guilty about it; ~everyone has some kind of privilege. But ignoring it or pretending it doesn’t exist is the exact opposite of the point, which is, at the end of the day, an exercise in empathy.

Where are people asked to feel guilty specifically about the fact they received a good education?

cpursley 5y ago

For similar reasons they're supposed to feel guilty for being born into a particular race.

borski 5y ago
You are equating guilt with acknowledging privilege, and those aren’t the same. I feel privileged for having gone to MIT, and acknowledge that privilege. I feel privileged for having grown up Jewish and white-appearing, and acknowledge that. I feel guilty for neither, and acknowledging that particular privilege takes nothing away from how hard I worked anyway. The son of two very poor Russian Jewish immigrants, I worked extremely hard to get to where I am. I also feel privileged for growing up in a loving and non-abusive family. Lots of people don’t have those things, and I’m thankful I did. That’s not guilt.
- notreallyserio 5y ago
  > You are equating guilt with acknowledging privilege, and those aren’t the same. This is one of those fundamental misunderstandings I see when discussing things with folks of a particular political persuasion. It's the same folks that belueve we shouldn't consider outcomes when evaluating processes. There's just something different about the way they think, I guess.
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]
- anamax 5y ago
  > You are equating guilt with acknowledging privilege, and those aren’t the same. When someone says "check your privilege", they're saying that you've done something wrong and should feel guilty.
  - borski 5y ago
    No, they aren’t. They are saying you should consider if and how your privilege helped you out, because sometimes that isn’t transferable to other people; someone black in a job interview may not have the same experience someone white does, and that’s okay, but it’s important to recognize if and how being white helped so that someone who isn’t white can account for that and adjust. It has nothing at all to do with guilt.
    - DangitBobby 5y ago
      It does have something to do with guilt, because the ultimate concession of acknowledging privilege is that you didn't truly earn your advantages, which is a root cause of perpetuated injustice. That's where the guilt lives: being the beneficiary of systematic injustice. This doesn't make you a bad person, of course; pretty much anyone in a position of privilege will capatalize on it, as that is human nature.
      - borski 5y ago
        Acknowledging privilege doesn’t imply you didn’t earn your advantages; it implies there were some that were handed to you. Plenty of others need to be earned. It is rare, extremely rare, to meet someone with absolutely no privilege, and that isn’t a place to aspire to.
    - anamax 5y ago
      > They are saying you should consider if and how your privilege helped you out Yes, they are. "Check your privilege" is often used to say "you didn't do that." Even if you assume that "privilege" is a big reason why you had an opportunity, there are almost always many people with the same "privilege" who didn't do said thing. Moreover, it's almost always some skin color argument. There are many "don't look white" people who had privileges that I didn't have but I'm supposed to "check my privilege."
      - borski 5y ago
        The idea is simply to acknowledge where your privilege helped you, and how others may not have had the same experiences or ease of access to certain things, etc. The trope of “he’s black and rich, and I’m white and poor” is irrelevant, as there are different kinds of privilege. In rural Alabama, being white and poor is going to lend you a much closer set of relationships than being black and rich. In SF, it may be the other way around - the point is everyone should simply be aware of how various privilege has helped them. And again: this takes nothing away from hard work. It simply acknowledges that another person who worked just as hard but had a different set of lived experiences and privileges may not have the same result. That’s not bad; just fact. And again: it has nothing to do with guilt. You shouldn’t feel guilty about it; ~everyone has some kind of privilege. But ignoring it or pretending it doesn’t exist is the exact opposite of the point, which is, at the end of the day, an exercise in empathy.