4 ms·

As a neurotypical, I hear all the time from others (especially coworkers in the field of IT) saying they're "a little autistic", at least to me these people cle

As a neurotypical, I hear all the time from others (especially coworkers in the field of IT) saying they're "a little autistic", at least to me these people clearly have done some research to conclude they can relate in some dimensions to clinical autism, not a confabulation made in-the-moment as a desperate and failed attempt to relate to someone who has to actually live with ASD. It really does linger in the mind of these people and they want to let others know about this important factoid about their personality as much as any other important point about them and their past. I agree, let them have it, but we should also have a social script when talking with people who live with ASD so we don't have individuals getting upset when the goal might have actually been to be vulnerable and open to sharing about themselves. Also, it appears all experts in the field believe ASD comes from assortive mating (people with similar genes that affect social function tend to come together). There should be resources for these people who think they're "a little autistic" and have clearly researched the topic to determine if it's safe for them to have children or if adoption is more appropriate. It's an unfortunate state of affairs but the experts are pointing to ASD as preventable, if you think you're almost on the spectrum and married to someone similar to yourself, consider researching the topic of "autism and assortive mating". The more open we are to talking about being "almost on the autism spectrum" and the more informed we are the better we all are!

emodendroket 5y ago
Do you mean to say that autistic people, or those with autistic traits who are not outright autistic, should not reproduce (with each other), because of the risk their children may be autistic?
- R0b0t1 5y ago
  That's what he is saying, yes. It's a dangerous thing to think because we do not understand if there is actually some hidden purpose to the genes that modulate autistic behavior, same with depression. It's a strange thing to bring up after assortative mating, really. If it comes up in assortative mating it implies there is a reason for the genes to be there. One example: In various experiments related to resource exhaustion, antisocial and/or "autistic" mice were the ones to survive the collapse of mouse society as they were more likely to not be involved over resource squabbles. Of course, there are some people who are very autistic who do not have very happy lives, and some people who are just kind of autistic.
- skim_milk 5y ago
  No personally, but I think an expert could analyze a couple for pregnancy risks and other issues at least. From what I've read in the past the risk goes up a bit, but not terribly significantly, so it's best to make people at least aware of the risks. Certainly at least not to the extent to force stop people from having kids! I think more than a third of ASD cases were estimated be linked to assortive mating in some studies, which is still a lot of cases that wouldn't happen if we changed out dating strategies! Intuitively this will only get worse with how everyone currently dates - dating until we finds the exact perfect match for our soul. The science is still very speculative but do we want time to tell?
  - emodendroket 5y ago
    We know for a fact that if both of your parents have African ancestry you have a higher risk of sickle-cell anemia, and if both your parents are Ashkenazi Jews you have a higher risk of Tay-Sachs. Should they also not be allowed to have children with each other? Frankly I find the notion shocking.
    - User23 5y ago
      There is no ethical alternative to voluntary assortative mating unless you want to legalize nonconsensual sex.
      - emodendroket 5y ago
        Well the other one would be forced sterilizations but that doesn’t sound a lot better.
    - darkerside 5y ago
      I think all anyone is talking about here is awareness of the likelihood. Sounds reasonable to me.
Der_Einzige 5y ago
I'm actually quite worried about this problem as someone who had an Asperger's diagnosis as a child. I've heard that there are medical procedures to allow one to specify which egg they want fertilized and where one can choose an egg which is certain to not have genetic disorders we can test for. Is autism something we can test for in the womb? If so, than this shouldn't be a problem for those with money (and my understanding is that the procedure I am describing costs about 20K). More broadly, I consider autism to be a strong net negative in my life, and I find folks who really embrace Asperger's as part of their identity to be alien to me. I'd love to eradicate this condition from the earth to spare future humans from the pain that inability to socialize will cause. I'm sure that some people who like their autism will be upset about "eugenics", but frankly, we don't have to be God damn Nazis to acknowledge that acting eugenicily is good and advocating for disgenic behavior is bad long term.
- emodendroket 5y ago
  > Is autism something we can test for in the womb? No. > I'm sure that some people who like their autism will be upset about "eugenics", but frankly, we don't have to be God damn Nazis to acknowledge that acting eugenicily is good and advocating for disgenic behavior is bad long term. Well you can pretty much say that Nazism is a natural, logical endpoint of eugenicist beliefs. If others decide not to cooperate in your little project of eliminating "dysgenic" traits then you'll have to compel them with force.

emodendroket 5y ago

Do you mean to say that autistic people, or those with autistic traits who are not outright autistic, should not reproduce (with each other), because of the risk their children may be autistic?

R0b0t1 5y ago
That's what he is saying, yes. It's a dangerous thing to think because we do not understand if there is actually some hidden purpose to the genes that modulate autistic behavior, same with depression. It's a strange thing to bring up after assortative mating, really. If it comes up in assortative mating it implies there is a reason for the genes to be there. One example: In various experiments related to resource exhaustion, antisocial and/or "autistic" mice were the ones to survive the collapse of mouse society as they were more likely to not be involved over resource squabbles. Of course, there are some people who are very autistic who do not have very happy lives, and some people who are just kind of autistic.
skim_milk 5y ago
No personally, but I think an expert could analyze a couple for pregnancy risks and other issues at least. From what I've read in the past the risk goes up a bit, but not terribly significantly, so it's best to make people at least aware of the risks. Certainly at least not to the extent to force stop people from having kids! I think more than a third of ASD cases were estimated be linked to assortive mating in some studies, which is still a lot of cases that wouldn't happen if we changed out dating strategies! Intuitively this will only get worse with how everyone currently dates - dating until we finds the exact perfect match for our soul. The science is still very speculative but do we want time to tell?
- emodendroket 5y ago
  We know for a fact that if both of your parents have African ancestry you have a higher risk of sickle-cell anemia, and if both your parents are Ashkenazi Jews you have a higher risk of Tay-Sachs. Should they also not be allowed to have children with each other? Frankly I find the notion shocking.
  - User23 5y ago
    There is no ethical alternative to voluntary assortative mating unless you want to legalize nonconsensual sex.
    - emodendroket 5y ago
      Well the other one would be forced sterilizations but that doesn’t sound a lot better.
  - darkerside 5y ago
    I think all anyone is talking about here is awareness of the likelihood. Sounds reasonable to me.

Der_Einzige 5y ago

I'm actually quite worried about this problem as someone who had an Asperger's diagnosis as a child. I've heard that there are medical procedures to allow one to specify which egg they want fertilized and where one can choose an egg which is certain to not have genetic disorders we can test for. Is autism something we can test for in the womb? If so, than this shouldn't be a problem for those with money (and my understanding is that the procedure I am describing costs about 20K). More broadly, I consider autism to be a strong net negative in my life, and I find folks who really embrace Asperger's as part of their identity to be alien to me. I'd love to eradicate this condition from the earth to spare future humans from the pain that inability to socialize will cause. I'm sure that some people who like their autism will be upset about "eugenics", but frankly, we don't have to be God damn Nazis to acknowledge that acting eugenicily is good and advocating for disgenic behavior is bad long term.

emodendroket 5y ago
> Is autism something we can test for in the womb? No. > I'm sure that some people who like their autism will be upset about "eugenics", but frankly, we don't have to be God damn Nazis to acknowledge that acting eugenicily is good and advocating for disgenic behavior is bad long term. Well you can pretty much say that Nazism is a natural, logical endpoint of eugenicist beliefs. If others decide not to cooperate in your little project of eliminating "dysgenic" traits then you'll have to compel them with force.