4 ms·

Thank you. So these are in fact all mistakes. I looked at some of the other forked repos (95 out of 4.5K repos) and all the human commits from MS I saw seem to

Thank you. So these are in fact all mistakes. I looked at some of the other forked repos (95 out of 4.5K repos) and all the human commits from MS I saw seem to care about getting the licenses right. So it really is just a broken bot. I hope the bot can be fixed soon and I'm going to put my figurative pitchfork down now.

verst 5y ago
I'll consider it an unusual bug report. Hopefully the bot can be fixed soon and the affected licenses changed back. Realistically I'm not sure folks are working over the holidays, so give it a bit of time :)
lazysheepherd 5y ago
Things break all the time, so errors will happen. If you look at life as good & evil, you won't solve any conflicts. You should rather focus on "incentives". Correcting bugs and errors take time and other resources, therefore require incentive to prioritize. If their bots were to stamp Microsoft projects with open source licenses, there would be huge incentive for them to tackle this problem within this sprint, and make sure it never happens again. This bug profits them, or does not harm them at worst case. Therefore, by drawing attention and applying pressure, we should create the incentive for them to allocate resources to fix it, and make sure it does not repeat.
michaelmrose 5y ago
How can someone be so bad at their job that they realize that a bot that writes to the license file needs to avoid overwriting an existing file? A certain degree of malfeasance cannot possibly be explained as incompetence.
- jolux 5y ago
  > A certain degree of malfeasance cannot possibly be explained as incompetence. This is a missing conditional check, a mistake that is extremely easy to make and one I’m sure you’ve made at least once if you’ve been a professional programmer for any significant length of time.
  - deleted 5y ago
    [deleted]
- csunbird 5y ago
  or maybe they do not know/they missed that creating a fork from an existing project actually triggers “new repo created” event in the github organization, which has an unintended effect.
  - michaelmrose 5y ago
- wiredone 5y ago
  This is the type of online rage that we as a community need to stamp out. Be better.
  - dang 5y ago
    I agree with you in principle but "stamp out" and "be better" are phrases that produce the opposite of what you're aiming at. We're trying to avoid the online callout/shaming culture here. https://hn.algolia.com/?sort=byDate&type=comment&dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=true&query=online%20shaming%20by%3Adang https://hn.algolia.com/?sort=byDate&type=comment&dateRange=a...
- dang 5y ago
  Please don't pile on like this. You can make your substantive points without "how can someone be so bad at their job" hyperbole. Any mistake can be made to look terrible if you're uncharitable enough. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
ognarb 5y ago
Look at https://github.com/microsoft/cups/commit/8100595a3a3a6d5c7d0ced7598807bad5c6d4d6c https://github.com/microsoft/cups/commit/8100595a3a3a6d5c7d0... . This was done by an human.
- btdmaster 5y ago
  Are they deliberately getting their modifications under an pseudo-incompatible* license? This is the only reasonable explanation I can think of. * IANAL. Although Apache 2.0 and MIT are compatible, using a different license makes it awkward for changes to be merged upstream.
  - ognarb 5y ago
    The biggest change between Apache 2.0 and MIT are related to patents. INAL but the Apache 2.0 is a lot more safe in this aspect.
- mst 5y ago
  As noted elsewhere in this thread this one looks like human misunderstanding and has already been raised internally for fixage. Shame it slipped through the cracks, but at scale eventually something's going to no matter how hard you try.
verst 5y ago
I reached out to Jeff Wilcox who runs the Open Source Programs Office now earlier (see Tweet https://twitter.com/berndverst/status/1474789173882089472?s=21 https://twitter.com/berndverst/status/1474789173882089472?s=...). He since commented on this post with a lot more detail.
- throwaway277432 5y ago
  He wrote a great response. Not many people I know would stand in front of a online mob and say "It's code that I wrote". And then fix it on Christmas! While I'm glad this got resolved so quickly, I'm slightly ashamed of myself and the HN community for how we handled this. In hindsight the outrage was wildly out of proportion for a simple bug. I'll make a mental note to do better in 2022.
  - tptacek 5y ago
    Thanks for saying this.

verst 5y ago

I'll consider it an unusual bug report. Hopefully the bot can be fixed soon and the affected licenses changed back. Realistically I'm not sure folks are working over the holidays, so give it a bit of time :)

lazysheepherd 5y ago

Things break all the time, so errors will happen. If you look at life as good & evil, you won't solve any conflicts. You should rather focus on "incentives". Correcting bugs and errors take time and other resources, therefore require incentive to prioritize. If their bots were to stamp Microsoft projects with open source licenses, there would be huge incentive for them to tackle this problem within this sprint, and make sure it never happens again. This bug profits them, or does not harm them at worst case. Therefore, by drawing attention and applying pressure, we should create the incentive for them to allocate resources to fix it, and make sure it does not repeat.

michaelmrose 5y ago

How can someone be so bad at their job that they realize that a bot that writes to the license file needs to avoid overwriting an existing file? A certain degree of malfeasance cannot possibly be explained as incompetence.

jolux 5y ago
> A certain degree of malfeasance cannot possibly be explained as incompetence. This is a missing conditional check, a mistake that is extremely easy to make and one I’m sure you’ve made at least once if you’ve been a professional programmer for any significant length of time.
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]
csunbird 5y ago
or maybe they do not know/they missed that creating a fork from an existing project actually triggers “new repo created” event in the github organization, which has an unintended effect.
- michaelmrose 5y ago
wiredone 5y ago
This is the type of online rage that we as a community need to stamp out. Be better.
- dang 5y ago
  I agree with you in principle but "stamp out" and "be better" are phrases that produce the opposite of what you're aiming at. We're trying to avoid the online callout/shaming culture here. https://hn.algolia.com/?sort=byDate&type=comment&dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=true&query=online%20shaming%20by%3Adang https://hn.algolia.com/?sort=byDate&type=comment&dateRange=a...
dang 5y ago
Please don't pile on like this. You can make your substantive points without "how can someone be so bad at their job" hyperbole. Any mistake can be made to look terrible if you're uncharitable enough. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

ognarb 5y ago

Look at https://github.com/microsoft/cups/commit/8100595a3a3a6d5c7d0ced7598807bad5c6d4d6c https://github.com/microsoft/cups/commit/8100595a3a3a6d5c7d0... . This was done by an human.

btdmaster 5y ago
Are they deliberately getting their modifications under an pseudo-incompatible* license? This is the only reasonable explanation I can think of. * IANAL. Although Apache 2.0 and MIT are compatible, using a different license makes it awkward for changes to be merged upstream.
- ognarb 5y ago
  The biggest change between Apache 2.0 and MIT are related to patents. INAL but the Apache 2.0 is a lot more safe in this aspect.
mst 5y ago
As noted elsewhere in this thread this one looks like human misunderstanding and has already been raised internally for fixage. Shame it slipped through the cracks, but at scale eventually something's going to no matter how hard you try.

verst 5y ago

I reached out to Jeff Wilcox who runs the Open Source Programs Office now earlier (see Tweet https://twitter.com/berndverst/status/1474789173882089472?s=21 https://twitter.com/berndverst/status/1474789173882089472?s=...). He since commented on this post with a lot more detail.

throwaway277432 5y ago
He wrote a great response. Not many people I know would stand in front of a online mob and say "It's code that I wrote". And then fix it on Christmas! While I'm glad this got resolved so quickly, I'm slightly ashamed of myself and the HN community for how we handled this. In hindsight the outrage was wildly out of proportion for a simple bug. I'll make a mental note to do better in 2022.
- tptacek 5y ago
  Thanks for saying this.