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> The move comes as a surprise How dense and gullible do you have to be? Do people keep forgetting they’re dealing with an authoritarian dictatorship? ANYTHI

> The move comes as a surprise How dense and gullible do you have to be? Do people keep forgetting they’re dealing with an authoritarian dictatorship? ANYTHING is on the table, nothing should come as a surprise. Divest from China and diversify manufacturing sources, otherwise we will wake up one day imprisoned, and „the move will come as a surprise“

threatofrain 5y ago
This is also not a surprise because tech journalists as early as February already anticipated that Valve working on a Chinese version of Steam implied a later ban for the "international" version.
ketzu 5y ago
> Do people keep forgetting they’re dealing with an authoritarian dictatorship? > ANYTHING is on the table, nothing should come as a surprise. That does not follow from the first part. People and politics can, at large, still be predictable independent of the political organization.
- pksebben 5y ago
  I would argue that any single individual is perfectly capable of being unpredictable, so any form of authoritarianism would derive that unpredictability. This is, fwig, the instability that a republic is meant to fix.
jetsetgo 5y ago
beebeepka 5y ago
- chunghuaming 5y ago
  You call it jingoism. I call it rise against dictatorships destroying democracy's way of life.
  - beebeepka 5y ago
    Is that so? Have you noticed which country is the source of this war against evil communist dictatorship? The US. Now, let's take a step back and consider some facts 1. China has not attacked any country in a long time. 2. The champions of free speech and democracy have destroyed millions just this last 20 years. Seems to me the villains are the ones screaming the loudest against their economic rival. You really think any of this has anything to do with human rights? You only hear the arguments of one side. At least acknowledge this simple fact, then go from there
    - stelonix 5y ago
      What's obvious for us who have been oppressed by the empire, for those who live there it might be impossible to see. They're the ones under propaganda 24/7, after all. Occam's razor works really well for many users of this site, but as soon as the subject is a rival superpower, everything is thrown out the window and it's the usual McCarthyism.
      - freeflight 5y ago
      - chunghuaming 5y ago
        Please tell me where you are from that you're being oppressed by US right now, not 10 years ago or 100 years ago. Also, US isn't the only democracy in the world (it's actually a representative republic, but anyways).
        freeflight 5y ago
- jdefr89 5y ago
  Doesn't come in waves, it's alway there. You only hear about it in waves...
nullifidian 5y ago
It's not a surprise because the localized version of steam done in cooperation with Perfect world, a Chinese publisher, was in development specifically for this purpose, I believe, i.e. the inevitable/planned replacement of foreign with local and fully controlled. Otherwise there wouldn't be a need to do it for Valve. Not surprising really considering how hard it is to publish a game in China to begin with -- you basically have to have a local company representing you, and they usually take 80-90% of your profits, that's on top of the the 30% share that stores take, and go through an extensive bureaucratic process, with various forms of censorship of course, and even then there is no guarantee that you will be allowed to publish. China tries and succeeds at playing the globalization game in a way that everyone else ends up dependent on them, but not the other way around. And the global corporations are stampeding over each others heads to betray all the principles there still are in the west for that sweet sweet access to the giant Chinese market, for the time being they are still allowed to that is.
netcan 5y ago
>> Divest from China and diversify manufacturing sources Who is this aimed at? Major brands (apple, tesla, disney, etc.) are not going to divest from China. China is a big part of their future market, they hope. They're going to invest wherever their market is. Obviously they know that this comes with strings and risks attached. They will get sideswiped with rules, punitive or otherwise. Authoritarian government action is just a risk, like any other risk. Apple might also lose their popularity. Disney might get There could be an economic downturn. These are all risks, and companies take risks. The reward is worth the risk, evidently. On the manufacturing side... there probably aren't as many surprises in the cards. Whatever qualms are to be had were had decades ago. On a side note, China is proof that 99% of chamber of commerce-ish "warnings" are nonsense. Investment goes wherever the market is, whatever the rules. The ccp could decree that all iphones must be red and starred as of next week. Apple would make red starred iphones, and Cook would make a public statement praising the wisdom of this regulation.
- chunghuaming 5y ago
  > Major brands (apple, tesla, disney, etc.) are not going to divest from China Diversification is already happening - 20,000 foreign companies have left China in the last 4 years. Samsung, LG, GoPro, etc. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lk6lkW4A7Ec https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lk6lkW4A7Ec > China is a big part of their future market The Unemployed and semi-unemployed might reach 300M+ people in China. Chinese consumer market is slowing down big time - Lost decades just like Japan https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lk6lkW4A7Ec https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lk6lkW4A7Ec
  - snicker7 5y ago
    China is not a rich country per capita (on par with LATAM), but it’s massive size is what attracts businesses.
kw-maller 5y ago
stjohnswarts 5y ago
Waiting until they declare VPNs as a crime punishable by 5-10 years in prison when you're caught using one.

threatofrain 5y ago

This is also not a surprise because tech journalists as early as February already anticipated that Valve working on a Chinese version of Steam implied a later ban for the "international" version.

ketzu 5y ago

> Do people keep forgetting they’re dealing with an authoritarian dictatorship? > ANYTHING is on the table, nothing should come as a surprise. That does not follow from the first part. People and politics can, at large, still be predictable independent of the political organization.

pksebben 5y ago
I would argue that any single individual is perfectly capable of being unpredictable, so any form of authoritarianism would derive that unpredictability. This is, fwig, the instability that a republic is meant to fix.

jetsetgo 5y ago

beebeepka 5y ago

chunghuaming 5y ago
You call it jingoism. I call it rise against dictatorships destroying democracy's way of life.
- beebeepka 5y ago
  Is that so? Have you noticed which country is the source of this war against evil communist dictatorship? The US. Now, let's take a step back and consider some facts 1. China has not attacked any country in a long time. 2. The champions of free speech and democracy have destroyed millions just this last 20 years. Seems to me the villains are the ones screaming the loudest against their economic rival. You really think any of this has anything to do with human rights? You only hear the arguments of one side. At least acknowledge this simple fact, then go from there
  - stelonix 5y ago
    What's obvious for us who have been oppressed by the empire, for those who live there it might be impossible to see. They're the ones under propaganda 24/7, after all. Occam's razor works really well for many users of this site, but as soon as the subject is a rival superpower, everything is thrown out the window and it's the usual McCarthyism.
    - freeflight 5y ago
    - chunghuaming 5y ago
      Please tell me where you are from that you're being oppressed by US right now, not 10 years ago or 100 years ago. Also, US isn't the only democracy in the world (it's actually a representative republic, but anyways).
      - freeflight 5y ago
jdefr89 5y ago
Doesn't come in waves, it's alway there. You only hear about it in waves...

nullifidian 5y ago

It's not a surprise because the localized version of steam done in cooperation with Perfect world, a Chinese publisher, was in development specifically for this purpose, I believe, i.e. the inevitable/planned replacement of foreign with local and fully controlled. Otherwise there wouldn't be a need to do it for Valve. Not surprising really considering how hard it is to publish a game in China to begin with -- you basically have to have a local company representing you, and they usually take 80-90% of your profits, that's on top of the the 30% share that stores take, and go through an extensive bureaucratic process, with various forms of censorship of course, and even then there is no guarantee that you will be allowed to publish. China tries and succeeds at playing the globalization game in a way that everyone else ends up dependent on them, but not the other way around. And the global corporations are stampeding over each others heads to betray all the principles there still are in the west for that sweet sweet access to the giant Chinese market, for the time being they are still allowed to that is.

netcan 5y ago

>> Divest from China and diversify manufacturing sources Who is this aimed at? Major brands (apple, tesla, disney, etc.) are not going to divest from China. China is a big part of their future market, they hope. They're going to invest wherever their market is. Obviously they know that this comes with strings and risks attached. They will get sideswiped with rules, punitive or otherwise. Authoritarian government action is just a risk, like any other risk. Apple might also lose their popularity. Disney might get There could be an economic downturn. These are all risks, and companies take risks. The reward is worth the risk, evidently. On the manufacturing side... there probably aren't as many surprises in the cards. Whatever qualms are to be had were had decades ago. On a side note, China is proof that 99% of chamber of commerce-ish "warnings" are nonsense. Investment goes wherever the market is, whatever the rules. The ccp could decree that all iphones must be red and starred as of next week. Apple would make red starred iphones, and Cook would make a public statement praising the wisdom of this regulation.

chunghuaming 5y ago
> Major brands (apple, tesla, disney, etc.) are not going to divest from China Diversification is already happening - 20,000 foreign companies have left China in the last 4 years. Samsung, LG, GoPro, etc. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lk6lkW4A7Ec https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lk6lkW4A7Ec > China is a big part of their future market The Unemployed and semi-unemployed might reach 300M+ people in China. Chinese consumer market is slowing down big time - Lost decades just like Japan https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lk6lkW4A7Ec https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lk6lkW4A7Ec
- snicker7 5y ago
  China is not a rich country per capita (on par with LATAM), but it’s massive size is what attracts businesses.

kw-maller 5y ago

stjohnswarts 5y ago

Waiting until they declare VPNs as a crime punishable by 5-10 years in prison when you're caught using one.