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Throats were slit? I never read that. If you believe in democracy you would celebrate the failure of a coup. Even if you hate the surviving leader, you ought t

Throats were slit? I never read that. If you believe in democracy you would celebrate the failure of a coup. Even if you hate the surviving leader, you ought to prefer defeating him within the frameworks of democracy. You seem to really dislike Muslim culture. If the people of Turkey want their culture to closer to that of Syria instead of Germany, what’s the problem?

nickff 5y ago
>"If you believe in democracy you would celebrate the failure of a coup. Even if you hate the surviving leader, you ought to prefer defeating him within the frameworks of democracy." You are supposing that the once freely-elected leader will permit a reversion to 'free' democracy. In fact, rigged elections form the basis of stable autocracies. Outright juntas and dictatorships are actually more likely to transition to 'free' democracies.[1] [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Logic_of_Political_Survival https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Logic_of_Political_Surviva...
grenoire 5y ago
The problem is that people suffer the transition's consequences. The current state of affairs has driven a rather large part of the country's population, who share Western ideals and want to pursue them for their nation, prefer a coup over whatever this ongoing messy loss of wealth and human capital is (certainly not 'democracy,' though). That should be telling, but it's hard to have Westerners empathise, I guess?
wheelerof4te 5y ago
Westerners think that their culture is the greatest of all time, how could you not accept it? They are even exporting it together with their bombs and missiles in case you don't comply /s But seriously, if their "culture" consists of gender theories, Holywood movies, superhero novels and the like, they can keep their culture.
- lostlogin 5y ago
  You’ve picked a subset of a subset of a subset. There is a little more to it than that, and a similar style summary of your preferred culture would be pretty dark.
ardacinar 5y ago
I remember there was an instance of a soldier being beheaded on the Bosphorus bridge. Not sure about the plural though
luckylion 5y ago
> If you believe in democracy you would celebrate the failure of a coup. That depends, I suppose. Hitler was democratically elected. Hard to say what might have happened, had one of the many plans to assassinate him had worked, but I'm not sure we'd look at it retrospectively as an attack on democracy.
cblconfederate 5y ago
> Even if you hate the surviving leader, you ought to prefer defeating him within the frameworks of democracy. Not in this case. The military (with its coups) was often the force that kept the turkish democracy alive, or else it would have fallen to many more dictators https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2016/7/16/timeline-a-history-of-turkish-coups https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2016/7/16/timeline-a-history-...

nickff 5y ago

>"If you believe in democracy you would celebrate the failure of a coup. Even if you hate the surviving leader, you ought to prefer defeating him within the frameworks of democracy." You are supposing that the once freely-elected leader will permit a reversion to 'free' democracy. In fact, rigged elections form the basis of stable autocracies. Outright juntas and dictatorships are actually more likely to transition to 'free' democracies.[1] [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Logic_of_Political_Survival https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Logic_of_Political_Surviva...

grenoire 5y ago

The problem is that people suffer the transition's consequences. The current state of affairs has driven a rather large part of the country's population, who share Western ideals and want to pursue them for their nation, prefer a coup over whatever this ongoing messy loss of wealth and human capital is (certainly not 'democracy,' though). That should be telling, but it's hard to have Westerners empathise, I guess?

wheelerof4te 5y ago

Westerners think that their culture is the greatest of all time, how could you not accept it? They are even exporting it together with their bombs and missiles in case you don't comply /s But seriously, if their "culture" consists of gender theories, Holywood movies, superhero novels and the like, they can keep their culture.

lostlogin 5y ago
You’ve picked a subset of a subset of a subset. There is a little more to it than that, and a similar style summary of your preferred culture would be pretty dark.

ardacinar 5y ago

I remember there was an instance of a soldier being beheaded on the Bosphorus bridge. Not sure about the plural though

luckylion 5y ago

> If you believe in democracy you would celebrate the failure of a coup. That depends, I suppose. Hitler was democratically elected. Hard to say what might have happened, had one of the many plans to assassinate him had worked, but I'm not sure we'd look at it retrospectively as an attack on democracy.

cblconfederate 5y ago

> Even if you hate the surviving leader, you ought to prefer defeating him within the frameworks of democracy. Not in this case. The military (with its coups) was often the force that kept the turkish democracy alive, or else it would have fallen to many more dictators https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2016/7/16/timeline-a-history-of-turkish-coups https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2016/7/16/timeline-a-history-...