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More quotes from actual article: > “Suppose there are people who say ‘it’s an attack on my liberty to make me stop at a red light. It’s government overreach.’

by spurgu 5y ago

More quotes from actual article: > “Suppose there are people who say ‘it’s an attack on my liberty to make me stop at a red light. It’s government overreach.’ They don’t want the state to have that power ‘over my private life’ … Well, such people should have the decency to remove themselves from the community,’” he said. Stopping at a red light is not a binary thing. It's simply unnecessary (I'll refrain from saying retarded) at certain times. You have a + junction where one side of the street has a stop sign just because the other one has one (because it has a bicycle lane crossing it, for example). I see zero moral qualm in ignoring that red light, especially at night. Promoting blind obedience is certainly not good for a free society.

spurgu 5y ago
I'm from Europe but I've heard there's a big difference between CA and NY in terms of jaywalking. Is one of the states right and the other wrong? Who should enforce their culture on the other one?
- JumpCrisscross 5y ago
  This is a good analogy. Neither should. But if I, a New Yorker, am ticketed for jaywalking in Phoenix, that’s their right. Them’s their streets. A lot of the bickering about vaccines comes from people who want to be in and benefit from urban centres yet not conform to their rules. If someone stays home and works remotely and orders Instacart, I don’t think they should be mandated to vaccinate.
eesmith 5y ago
I interpreted Chomsky's comment more as `it’s an attack on my liberty [for the government to have the authority] to make me stop at a red light.' not `it’s an attack on my liberty to make me stop at a red light [no matter the circumstances].' Though, oddly, your example was a stop sign .. and doing a rolling stop at a stop sign is probably the most common illegal action people do. I see nothing here that suggests Chomsky is promoting blind obedience. We know from his own history he was prepared to go to jail as a result of his anti-war civil disobedience. Surely that's the direct analogy. The state currently has the power to compel vaccination (Jacobson v. Massachusetts). If you have a principled objection to that law, then like every other action of civil disobedience (MLK, Megan Ric, and many more) be prepared to be removed from society. Who knows, your action might even cause the law to be removed. (To be clear, Chomsky is not asking for the government to assert this power, but rather for the unvaccinated to voluntarily withdraw from society, though this may change if COVID becomes something more like smallpox.)

by spurgu 5y ago

spurgu 5y ago

I'm from Europe but I've heard there's a big difference between CA and NY in terms of jaywalking. Is one of the states right and the other wrong? Who should enforce their culture on the other one?

JumpCrisscross 5y ago
This is a good analogy. Neither should. But if I, a New Yorker, am ticketed for jaywalking in Phoenix, that’s their right. Them’s their streets. A lot of the bickering about vaccines comes from people who want to be in and benefit from urban centres yet not conform to their rules. If someone stays home and works remotely and orders Instacart, I don’t think they should be mandated to vaccinate.

eesmith 5y ago

I interpreted Chomsky's comment more as `it’s an attack on my liberty [for the government to have the authority] to make me stop at a red light.' not `it’s an attack on my liberty to make me stop at a red light [no matter the circumstances].' Though, oddly, your example was a stop sign .. and doing a rolling stop at a stop sign is probably the most common illegal action people do. I see nothing here that suggests Chomsky is promoting blind obedience. We know from his own history he was prepared to go to jail as a result of his anti-war civil disobedience. Surely that's the direct analogy. The state currently has the power to compel vaccination (Jacobson v. Massachusetts). If you have a principled objection to that law, then like every other action of civil disobedience (MLK, Megan Ric, and many more) be prepared to be removed from society. Who knows, your action might even cause the law to be removed. (To be clear, Chomsky is not asking for the government to assert this power, but rather for the unvaccinated to voluntarily withdraw from society, though this may change if COVID becomes something more like smallpox.)