3 ms·

> Most educated Chinese people at least speak English to some degree, they're heavily exposed to Western popular culture So, anecdotally that's your experience

> Most educated Chinese people at least speak English to some degree, they're heavily exposed to Western popular culture So, anecdotally that's your experience, ok. I don't think a greater exposure to pop-culture necessarily makes on better equipped to talk about the ethics of censorship, forced labor, and the dangers of centralized systems. I'd wager as far as substantive information goes, the asymmetry you're describing doesn't exist. > I don't think watching CNN or reading the NY Times regularly will confer even a basic understanding Most people, educated or not, know this. Thankfully we have access to the entire internet and the entire body of human literature, even among those not tech savvy enough to use a VPN. My argument is not 'cable news does a great job', my argument is 'the wests liberal access to information and wealth affords it's affluent and educated a more complete and clear picture of the world', which you are failing to rebut.

DiogenesKynikos 5y ago
> So, anecdotally that's your experience Yes, anecdotally, almost every single educated person I know in the West is remarkably ignorant about China. They don't know even the most basic things, like the names of the major provinces or the names of cities with 15 million people. They couldn't tell you the first thing about Chinese history. When did the empire fall? They couldn't name one major Chinese literary figure in the last 500 years. I'm talking about people who are fairly international, who might speak a few different European languages. The sheer lack of knowledge is really striking. I don't think it's the case that the people I know are almost all anomalous in this way. Knowledge of China is simply near zilch in the West. Young, educated Chinese people practically all speak English to at least a basic level. That already gives them more knowledge about the West than the average educated Westerner has of China. > forced labor I'm assuming you're talking about Xinjiang. This is an issue that I am certain your average person in China understands far better than your average New York Times reader. The programs that are being labeled "forced labor" by the US government are fairly well known in China. With a lot of these types of China stories that hit the news from time to time in the West, you'll find that the average taxi driver in China knows more detail than what you'll read in Western newspapers. The idea that Westerners know what's going on in China better than people in China do is just hubris.

DiogenesKynikos 5y ago

> So, anecdotally that's your experience Yes, anecdotally, almost every single educated person I know in the West is remarkably ignorant about China. They don't know even the most basic things, like the names of the major provinces or the names of cities with 15 million people. They couldn't tell you the first thing about Chinese history. When did the empire fall? They couldn't name one major Chinese literary figure in the last 500 years. I'm talking about people who are fairly international, who might speak a few different European languages. The sheer lack of knowledge is really striking. I don't think it's the case that the people I know are almost all anomalous in this way. Knowledge of China is simply near zilch in the West. Young, educated Chinese people practically all speak English to at least a basic level. That already gives them more knowledge about the West than the average educated Westerner has of China. > forced labor I'm assuming you're talking about Xinjiang. This is an issue that I am certain your average person in China understands far better than your average New York Times reader. The programs that are being labeled "forced labor" by the US government are fairly well known in China. With a lot of these types of China stories that hit the news from time to time in the West, you'll find that the average taxi driver in China knows more detail than what you'll read in Western newspapers. The idea that Westerners know what's going on in China better than people in China do is just hubris.