3 ms·

It's not "do fixed pile of work every week." It's "provide a multiple of N worth of your salary value to the company." The amount of work necessary to do so i

It's not "do fixed pile of work every week." It's "provide a multiple of N worth of your salary value to the company." The amount of work necessary to do so is (should be) irrelevant. Effort is not relevant, and you don't get to demand I commit body and soul to please you if I'm providing a reasonable amount of value.

PragmaticPulp 5y ago
No, it's about "Is this employee occupying headcount and payroll that would be better used on someone more deserving". And you've still misunderstand the 2-way feedback loop about effort estimation. You have this misconception that a job is an isolated 1:1 relationship with an employer where units of work are passed in isolation back and forth. In the real world, something like this does huge damage to the team by forcing everyone else to compensate for the deliberate underperformance.
- actually_a_dog 5y ago
  Oh, wait, now I need to deserve a job in addition to being able to perform all aspects of it adequately with respect to the offered compensation? You really are something if that's what you believe.
  - PragmaticPulp 5y ago
    > Oh, wait, now I need to deserve a job I didn't say a job. I said the job I'm hiring for. If you're going to come in and deliberately do as little work as possible to extract as much as possible from the team, why should I give the job to you instead of someone who is actually honest and cares? You're not entitled to any job you want, obviously. I usually have 10-100 applicants who would honestly do the job and not sandbag their work onto peers. Obviously we would all rather have the honest employees working on the team. In what moral system do you deserve the job more than literally any other honest employee if you're dead set on doing less than them and lying your way through the job? If nothing else, having two jobs becomes a conflict of interest with a huge monetary incentive to continue lying. There's also the matter of trade secrets as people often come from related companies.
    - actually_a_dog 5y ago
      Well, okay. If I can do the job, and I am doing the job adequately relative to the compensation offered, why do I need to deserve your job?

PragmaticPulp 5y ago

No, it's about "Is this employee occupying headcount and payroll that would be better used on someone more deserving". And you've still misunderstand the 2-way feedback loop about effort estimation. You have this misconception that a job is an isolated 1:1 relationship with an employer where units of work are passed in isolation back and forth. In the real world, something like this does huge damage to the team by forcing everyone else to compensate for the deliberate underperformance.

actually_a_dog 5y ago
Oh, wait, now I need to deserve a job in addition to being able to perform all aspects of it adequately with respect to the offered compensation? You really are something if that's what you believe.
- PragmaticPulp 5y ago
  > Oh, wait, now I need to deserve a job I didn't say a job. I said the job I'm hiring for. If you're going to come in and deliberately do as little work as possible to extract as much as possible from the team, why should I give the job to you instead of someone who is actually honest and cares? You're not entitled to any job you want, obviously. I usually have 10-100 applicants who would honestly do the job and not sandbag their work onto peers. Obviously we would all rather have the honest employees working on the team. In what moral system do you deserve the job more than literally any other honest employee if you're dead set on doing less than them and lying your way through the job? If nothing else, having two jobs becomes a conflict of interest with a huge monetary incentive to continue lying. There's also the matter of trade secrets as people often come from related companies.
  - actually_a_dog 5y ago
    Well, okay. If I can do the job, and I am doing the job adequately relative to the compensation offered, why do I need to deserve your job?