6 ms·

Drugs significantly alter cognitive processes and perceptions. I know that reads like a duh comment because that's literally why people take them, but it's amaz

Drugs significantly alter cognitive processes and perceptions. I know that reads like a duh comment because that's literally why people take them, but it's amazing how frequently drugs users forget that the drugs alter their perceptions of how the drug is impacting their lives. I've fortunately only had a few of my friends succumb to addictions, but it was surreal to watch them remain convinced that the drugs (including alcohol) were actually helping their performance, relationships, and productivity while everyone around them could clearly see that the opposite was happening. One of the most striking examples is benzodiazepine abuse. Benzos famously mislead users into a false sense of sobriety even when they may be so inebriated that they struggle to accomplish basic tasks. Within the tech scene, I've also noticed this with LSD microdosing. The few people I know who (openly) tried it were convinced they were smarter and more productive while microdosing, but it was objectively clear to everyone else that they were thinking more slowly, generally more confused, making more mistakes, and so on. The difference is that the drug convinced them that everything they accomplished was a wonderful achievement that made them happy, which led them to perceptions that they were accomplishing more on those days. I see similar trends in acquaintances with excessive marijuana habits: A general belief that the drug is helping them do more of the things they want to do, but they're clearly doing very little on the days they smoke. Obvious from the outside, hard to see from the inside when your perceptions are being bent to extremes.

thewarrior 5y ago
I think that people thinking that mind altering substances cannot be a useful tool should keep an open mind about it and let those people who are getting real results out of it keep doing their thing. And yes these people do exist. They are not going to be too open about it because of how taboo it is. It’s well known that many of the greatest rock bands, highly productive mathematicians like Paul Erdos and comedians like George Carlin found great benefits in the disciplined use of mind altering substances. Not the addictive side which he regretted but the occasional one as a creative boost. Steve Jobs swore that it changed him. Not that it was perfect but he himself claimed it played a pivotal role in shaping him into the unique person that he was. There are peer reviewed studies that show that psychedelics are among the most effective tools for treating depression. ADHD medication is prescribed quite often today and it’s a game changer for many people. This is not without its dangers so proceed with caution and have other people in your life to check on you often. But let’s not deny the enormous power. Why should some stimulants like caffeine or alcohol be permitted for responsible use while others have to be kept away ? Many of them are less addictive than either. And besides far beyond any argument about utility it’s also one about aesthetics and spirituality. It’s an entire new dimension to the human experience. If you don’t have a good track record of practicing moderation then stay away.
- vlovich123 5y ago
  That may be the case but we should also be careful to not assume that people under the influence are able to accurately evaluate its impact on their performance. Nor should we extrapolate on the general impact based on the experiences of some. Not everyone smoking that jazz cabbage is a Steve Jobs. And there’s no guarantee that the change it has is good for that person (eg triggering some latent susceptibility to schizophrenia as we know LSD can do from the MK Ultra experiments)
  - couchand 5y ago
    I do like the sound of "jazz cabbage", but I think you're using it derisively and possibly with a tinge of racism. And that makes me sad.
    - vlovich123 5y ago
      I got it from Fake Doctors, Real Friends. I think the perception of derision/racism is solely on your end.
- noah_buddy 5y ago
  Paul Erdos took uppers, specifically Ritalin and caffeine, IIRC. Carlin was pretty vocal about the majorly negative impacts of drug abuse on his life and even went to rehab. Prior discussion on Erdos, https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=2497420 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=2497420
  - frank_nitti 5y ago
    Carlin made a very clear exception for marijuana for his creative work. https://youtu.be/nCGGWeD_EJk?t=6m50s https://youtu.be/nCGGWeD_EJk?t=6m50s I understand the comment thread you are responding to is lumping many psychoactive substances together, but the authors of the posted study were careful to distinguish this.
    - thewarrior 5y ago
shawnz 5y ago
Anecdotally, I was a daily cannabis smoker for many years, had to quit about 5 months ago and have noticed persistently decreased focus and productivity since then.
TigeriusKirk 5y ago
My experience with LSD in my 20s was about as far from "micro" dosing as you can get. With that in mind, I found that while I did have some truly profound experiences, most often it was more along the lines of wasting time having fun. And things that seemed really deep while tripping were obviously and unambiguously superficial afterwards. From various experimentations over the years, the only drugs that make a real positive difference in my cognitive function are caffeine (in large doses) and alcohol (in small to moderate doses).

thewarrior 5y ago

I think that people thinking that mind altering substances cannot be a useful tool should keep an open mind about it and let those people who are getting real results out of it keep doing their thing. And yes these people do exist. They are not going to be too open about it because of how taboo it is. It’s well known that many of the greatest rock bands, highly productive mathematicians like Paul Erdos and comedians like George Carlin found great benefits in the disciplined use of mind altering substances. Not the addictive side which he regretted but the occasional one as a creative boost. Steve Jobs swore that it changed him. Not that it was perfect but he himself claimed it played a pivotal role in shaping him into the unique person that he was. There are peer reviewed studies that show that psychedelics are among the most effective tools for treating depression. ADHD medication is prescribed quite often today and it’s a game changer for many people. This is not without its dangers so proceed with caution and have other people in your life to check on you often. But let’s not deny the enormous power. Why should some stimulants like caffeine or alcohol be permitted for responsible use while others have to be kept away ? Many of them are less addictive than either. And besides far beyond any argument about utility it’s also one about aesthetics and spirituality. It’s an entire new dimension to the human experience. If you don’t have a good track record of practicing moderation then stay away.

vlovich123 5y ago
That may be the case but we should also be careful to not assume that people under the influence are able to accurately evaluate its impact on their performance. Nor should we extrapolate on the general impact based on the experiences of some. Not everyone smoking that jazz cabbage is a Steve Jobs. And there’s no guarantee that the change it has is good for that person (eg triggering some latent susceptibility to schizophrenia as we know LSD can do from the MK Ultra experiments)
- couchand 5y ago
  I do like the sound of "jazz cabbage", but I think you're using it derisively and possibly with a tinge of racism. And that makes me sad.
  - vlovich123 5y ago
    I got it from Fake Doctors, Real Friends. I think the perception of derision/racism is solely on your end.
noah_buddy 5y ago
Paul Erdos took uppers, specifically Ritalin and caffeine, IIRC. Carlin was pretty vocal about the majorly negative impacts of drug abuse on his life and even went to rehab. Prior discussion on Erdos, https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=2497420 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=2497420
- frank_nitti 5y ago
  Carlin made a very clear exception for marijuana for his creative work. https://youtu.be/nCGGWeD_EJk?t=6m50s https://youtu.be/nCGGWeD_EJk?t=6m50s I understand the comment thread you are responding to is lumping many psychoactive substances together, but the authors of the posted study were careful to distinguish this.
  - thewarrior 5y ago

shawnz 5y ago

Anecdotally, I was a daily cannabis smoker for many years, had to quit about 5 months ago and have noticed persistently decreased focus and productivity since then.

TigeriusKirk 5y ago

My experience with LSD in my 20s was about as far from "micro" dosing as you can get. With that in mind, I found that while I did have some truly profound experiences, most often it was more along the lines of wasting time having fun. And things that seemed really deep while tripping were obviously and unambiguously superficial afterwards. From various experimentations over the years, the only drugs that make a real positive difference in my cognitive function are caffeine (in large doses) and alcohol (in small to moderate doses).