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You seem to be attacking Western governments assuming we want to defend them? Our identity it's not tied to our governments, unlike you, we criticize them ALL

You seem to be attacking Western governments assuming we want to defend them? Our identity it's not tied to our governments, unlike you, we criticize them ALL the time. They do horrible things, but because a Western government has done horrible things doesn't mean China gets to do it too. We are not attacking you as a Chinese citizen, we are attacking the governments who do wrong. This comment chain is specifically about China's government's atrocities. If every time we criticized one government, we had to include all of them in the same post, that would be insane trying to list every single thing.

tombh 5y ago
It seems you may think I'm Chinese? I'm actually 100% British. I think something to bear in mind with the topic of comparing the West and China is that they aren't actually 2 independent entities that have now come of age, each imposing its unique stamp on the world. What China is today is fundamentally defined by European colonialism. Chinese culture is actually thousands of years older than European culture, and for the majority of human history was the most advanced, richest and successful, at least certainly in comparison to Europe pre and post the Romans. Now recall what Europe did to Native American, African and Australian cultures, which cover almost half the planet. China has something called The Century of Humiliation[1]. Those colonial forces that banished the Cherokee, the Inca, the Mbundu, the aborigines, to the pages of history, eventually arrived in China, and I think quite understandably China fought tooth and nail to avoid the same fate. So when I criticise those in the West that criticise China, I'm not just trying to equalise the argument to include criticism of all governments. China is not just another evil empire. Modern China is specifically what happens when you have the desire, and more importantly means, to defend yourself against the forces of Western colonialism. China famously burnt its colonial fleet in the 15th Century[2], they are actually not a naturally colonial culture. A metaphor could be something like: when you punch so many people so hard, that most of them die, it's impossible for them to criticise your behaviour, because they're, well dead. So when one of them, after seeing all the dead people, and then getting punched themselves, manages to survive, and even starts to return punches in order to survive, those "fists" of criticism are an extremely understandable survival instinct. Pointing the finger at China's "punches" is profoundly ironic, because not only have we thrown more punches, and caused more destruction, but we incited those punches. 1. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Century_of_humiliation https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Century_of_humiliation 2. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ming_treasure_voyages#Causes_of_cessation https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ming_treasure_voyages#Causes_o...
- philliphaydon 5y ago
  I’m unsure how you can justify the present based on what happened in the past. It just sounds like you’re making excuses for justification. China has a long history colonialism, just like pretty much any other empire in history. So unsure how you can claim they don’t have colonial nature.

tombh 5y ago

It seems you may think I'm Chinese? I'm actually 100% British. I think something to bear in mind with the topic of comparing the West and China is that they aren't actually 2 independent entities that have now come of age, each imposing its unique stamp on the world. What China is today is fundamentally defined by European colonialism. Chinese culture is actually thousands of years older than European culture, and for the majority of human history was the most advanced, richest and successful, at least certainly in comparison to Europe pre and post the Romans. Now recall what Europe did to Native American, African and Australian cultures, which cover almost half the planet. China has something called The Century of Humiliation[1]. Those colonial forces that banished the Cherokee, the Inca, the Mbundu, the aborigines, to the pages of history, eventually arrived in China, and I think quite understandably China fought tooth and nail to avoid the same fate. So when I criticise those in the West that criticise China, I'm not just trying to equalise the argument to include criticism of all governments. China is not just another evil empire. Modern China is specifically what happens when you have the desire, and more importantly means, to defend yourself against the forces of Western colonialism. China famously burnt its colonial fleet in the 15th Century[2], they are actually not a naturally colonial culture. A metaphor could be something like: when you punch so many people so hard, that most of them die, it's impossible for them to criticise your behaviour, because they're, well dead. So when one of them, after seeing all the dead people, and then getting punched themselves, manages to survive, and even starts to return punches in order to survive, those "fists" of criticism are an extremely understandable survival instinct. Pointing the finger at China's "punches" is profoundly ironic, because not only have we thrown more punches, and caused more destruction, but we incited those punches. 1. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Century_of_humiliation https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Century_of_humiliation 2. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ming_treasure_voyages#Causes_of_cessation https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ming_treasure_voyages#Causes_o...

philliphaydon 5y ago
I’m unsure how you can justify the present based on what happened in the past. It just sounds like you’re making excuses for justification. China has a long history colonialism, just like pretty much any other empire in history. So unsure how you can claim they don’t have colonial nature.