4 ms·

I wish I could agree with you. But so many things are apps now, only available from official app stores. This goes far beyond convenience, at least in my countr

by rvense 5y ago

I wish I could agree with you. But so many things are apps now, only available from official app stores. This goes far beyond convenience, at least in my country. You can't park a car in many places in my city without paying via an app. Nobody uses cash here anymore, everyone uses cards, and for private transactions there's an app (yes, just one, owned by one of the banks). So if you want to buy stuff from someone who isn't a shop, say at a flea market, or split the bill for dinner when you're out with some friends, you need that app to participate. The app is tied to a bank account (in any bank), but this is not a problem since everyone has bank accounts (government mandate). Most of the big supermarket chains have their own apps now that can be used for payments. Of course, you can still by card or cash. Accepting cash is a legal requirement, but that is likely to be phased out over the next few years, and who knows what framework will replace it. If it becomes legally possible, I wouldn't rule out some places being inaccessible to the non-smartphoned here in time, since penetration is so high. We have government mandated single sign-on service that is a requirement for communicating with any public institution, as well as banks and many other places. It doesn't strictly require an app in its current form (you can get a printed one-time pad), but there's a new version just being introduced that seems to be even more tied to the app, and the alternative seems to be exclusively meant for senior citizens.

coldtea 5y ago
>You can't park a car in many places in my city without paying via an app. So? Just get a cheapo iPhone or Android and use said app. You don't have to make your phone the center of your life.
- rvense 5y ago
  It's an interesting argument, because you're saying it's fine that we're forced to have one of these devices, and that we're expected to carry it everywhere, or face being excluded from many aspects of society. For some things I can accept it (parking is a grey area to me personally since I don't actually know how to drive), but for e.g. person-to-person payments, I find the current situation untenable.
lrvick 5y ago
Sorry, but these seem like weak excuses for complying with what sounds like a brutal corporate takeover of your country. I don't have a cell carrier or any Apple/Google controlled devices. I run a b2b tech company and it isn't a problem. When I really need to send an email or chat message I find WiFi to connect my small CalyxOS device to. The rest of the time I am living in the moment without notifications and this has done wonders for my mental health and social relationships as I plan things ahead and act with more intention. When parking spots require Apps I find there is normally a webapp or a parking attendant that accepts cash. When there isn't I park further away and get some extra exercise. When I split a bill with friends I use cash or crypto-assets. When a restaurant demands I use my phone to view the menu I ask for a paper one. When all hospitals in my area required I use their proprietary app, I accepted the appointment in the webapp, cited that the app didn't work on my device, and was able to get the doctor to call me on my VoIP line. I am finding out recently I can use cash or prepaid Visa cards almost anywhere if I ask. I am not aware of a single democratic country with any laws that can mandate all citizens accept the terms of service of Apple or Google. Any private entity that demands you accept them must be avoided. If all private entities do this and you literally can't use essential services like grocery stores, then you must bring it to the attention of your local legislators as a serious discrimination issue. You could be the squeaky wheel that sparks change in your area. We have a right to live fulfilling lives in the modern world without accepting Google or Apple ToS.
- rvense 5y ago
  > We have a right to live fulfilling lives in the modern world without accepting Google or Apple ToS. Oh, I agree, and I don't actually have a phone with an app store. So I'm seeing that it's becoming increasingly difficult. The payments thing is becoming really bad, in particular. As I said, businesses are legally required to take cash, but most people don't want it anymore.

by rvense 5y ago

coldtea 5y ago

>You can't park a car in many places in my city without paying via an app. So? Just get a cheapo iPhone or Android and use said app. You don't have to make your phone the center of your life.

rvense 5y ago
It's an interesting argument, because you're saying it's fine that we're forced to have one of these devices, and that we're expected to carry it everywhere, or face being excluded from many aspects of society. For some things I can accept it (parking is a grey area to me personally since I don't actually know how to drive), but for e.g. person-to-person payments, I find the current situation untenable.

lrvick 5y ago

Sorry, but these seem like weak excuses for complying with what sounds like a brutal corporate takeover of your country. I don't have a cell carrier or any Apple/Google controlled devices. I run a b2b tech company and it isn't a problem. When I really need to send an email or chat message I find WiFi to connect my small CalyxOS device to. The rest of the time I am living in the moment without notifications and this has done wonders for my mental health and social relationships as I plan things ahead and act with more intention. When parking spots require Apps I find there is normally a webapp or a parking attendant that accepts cash. When there isn't I park further away and get some extra exercise. When I split a bill with friends I use cash or crypto-assets. When a restaurant demands I use my phone to view the menu I ask for a paper one. When all hospitals in my area required I use their proprietary app, I accepted the appointment in the webapp, cited that the app didn't work on my device, and was able to get the doctor to call me on my VoIP line. I am finding out recently I can use cash or prepaid Visa cards almost anywhere if I ask. I am not aware of a single democratic country with any laws that can mandate all citizens accept the terms of service of Apple or Google. Any private entity that demands you accept them must be avoided. If all private entities do this and you literally can't use essential services like grocery stores, then you must bring it to the attention of your local legislators as a serious discrimination issue. You could be the squeaky wheel that sparks change in your area. We have a right to live fulfilling lives in the modern world without accepting Google or Apple ToS.

rvense 5y ago
> We have a right to live fulfilling lives in the modern world without accepting Google or Apple ToS. Oh, I agree, and I don't actually have a phone with an app store. So I'm seeing that it's becoming increasingly difficult. The payments thing is becoming really bad, in particular. As I said, businesses are legally required to take cash, but most people don't want it anymore.