4 ms·

Basically rubber hose crypto analysis, but is there any evidence of this? The article makes no mention of it. Like the could have also seized is electronic dev

by anfilt 5y ago

Basically rubber hose crypto analysis, but is there any evidence of this? The article makes no mention of it. Like the could have also seized is electronic devices and just found a copy of the key somewhere.

DennisP 5y ago
Or they got a search warrant and found his 24 words, in his house or safe deposit box. Or they surveilled him and found where he hid them. It's pretty hard to keep your keys safe from an attacker able to do that sort of thing, without adding serious risk of accidental loss.
- paulpauper 5y ago
  yeah he was probably sloppy
paulpauper 5y ago
as usual, key (no pun indented) details intentionally left out
PKop 5y ago
>The article makes no mention of it And I would bet the FBI is not going to say publicly. It could be beneficial to the US Government to have people believe they have the capability to just steal private keys, even if in fact they just negotiated for it.
ceejayoz 5y ago
Both are plausible avenues, sure. Ultimately, the point is “once law enforcement has you and your devices in their hands, it’s probably all over”.
- javajosh 5y ago
  The implication is really strong here that they'll coerce you, and that's okay. I hope they don't, and it's not okay if they do. You should be able to invoke the 5th and be silent on any matter, including producing information required to decrypt a private key. Of course, this happened in Japan, it sounds like, and perhaps they have different rules. If so, that sucks and they should change them because torture is morally wrong.
  - brigandish 5y ago
    Habeas corpus is not a thing in Japan, they basically hold you until you confess. There's also no bail. I like how the lawyer in this interview doesn't seem impressed by the system he has to work in. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r1ZLGqL1FMo https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r1ZLGqL1FMo
    - bena 5y ago
      From what I understand, going to trial in Japan is mostly determining your sentence, guilt is the default assumption. Getting a not guilty verdict is incredibly rare.
      - numpad0 5y ago
        Japanese legal system is a bit like a car with missing trim pieces that were to be installed before the sale. Like you are supposed to be able to place your hands on the middle of the dashboard in rough roads, but in this car you have to carefully hold at edges, gloved. There seems to be law texts and systems which intent or behavior or actions to be taken is only clear with the knowledge of legal systems in other nations.
    - JetAlone 5y ago
      The video reminds me that sometimes I feel tempted to add something to the graffiti in places in Shibuya, or Akiba where it's already teeming. Life here in offices day in and day out is extremely boring, and any given change you might want to make to your life whether you're a local or a foreigner has a hundred and eight barriers. I tell myself the excitement isn't worth the risk, but that's backwards; risk is part of the excitement.
  - yborg 5y ago
    Stealing is kind of morally wrong as well. And if this guy was innocent, it would have been hard for them to get the private key out of him, since he wouldn't have known it.
  - kingcharles 5y ago

by anfilt 5y ago

DennisP 5y ago

Or they got a search warrant and found his 24 words, in his house or safe deposit box. Or they surveilled him and found where he hid them. It's pretty hard to keep your keys safe from an attacker able to do that sort of thing, without adding serious risk of accidental loss.

paulpauper 5y ago
yeah he was probably sloppy

paulpauper 5y ago

as usual, key (no pun indented) details intentionally left out

PKop 5y ago

>The article makes no mention of it And I would bet the FBI is not going to say publicly. It could be beneficial to the US Government to have people believe they have the capability to just steal private keys, even if in fact they just negotiated for it.

ceejayoz 5y ago

Both are plausible avenues, sure. Ultimately, the point is “once law enforcement has you and your devices in their hands, it’s probably all over”.

javajosh 5y ago
The implication is really strong here that they'll coerce you, and that's okay. I hope they don't, and it's not okay if they do. You should be able to invoke the 5th and be silent on any matter, including producing information required to decrypt a private key. Of course, this happened in Japan, it sounds like, and perhaps they have different rules. If so, that sucks and they should change them because torture is morally wrong.
- brigandish 5y ago
  Habeas corpus is not a thing in Japan, they basically hold you until you confess. There's also no bail. I like how the lawyer in this interview doesn't seem impressed by the system he has to work in. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r1ZLGqL1FMo https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r1ZLGqL1FMo
  - bena 5y ago
    From what I understand, going to trial in Japan is mostly determining your sentence, guilt is the default assumption. Getting a not guilty verdict is incredibly rare.
    - numpad0 5y ago
      Japanese legal system is a bit like a car with missing trim pieces that were to be installed before the sale. Like you are supposed to be able to place your hands on the middle of the dashboard in rough roads, but in this car you have to carefully hold at edges, gloved. There seems to be law texts and systems which intent or behavior or actions to be taken is only clear with the knowledge of legal systems in other nations.
  - JetAlone 5y ago
    The video reminds me that sometimes I feel tempted to add something to the graffiti in places in Shibuya, or Akiba where it's already teeming. Life here in offices day in and day out is extremely boring, and any given change you might want to make to your life whether you're a local or a foreigner has a hundred and eight barriers. I tell myself the excitement isn't worth the risk, but that's backwards; risk is part of the excitement.
- yborg 5y ago
  Stealing is kind of morally wrong as well. And if this guy was innocent, it would have been hard for them to get the private key out of him, since he wouldn't have known it.
- kingcharles 5y ago