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I have been using matrix for quite a while now, and managed to get the people I write the most with on it too! Back then I rented matrix hosting with modular.i

I have been using matrix for quite a while now, and managed to get the people I write the most with on it too! Back then I rented matrix hosting with modular.im (now called ems) once I noticed that I did use Riot/Element on a daily basis, and the latency of matrix.org servers was too big for my taste, combined with the lack of online status display. Now that dendrite is starting to finally mature, I will probably switch to hosting it myself to save some costs. Main things stopping me are the possible headaches around domain names and federations: How hard is it to move to a different hoster once I have an instance running? I read in the documentation that things can become problematic if I don't carefully backup parts of my dendrite matrix instance. What would happen if I (or rather my hosting provider) lose my files and have to setup my matrix instance from scratch, will my domain then remain blocked on the federation, even when I still have control over the domain? It's not that I don't do backups, but I'm curious what would happen in a worst case scenario.

jeroenhd 5y ago
I believe federation recovery should be possible assuming you have access to the server's signing key. Without it, you'll probably run into conflicts. You'll definitely have problems with missing rooms, missing user encryption, the lot of it. I think it should be possible to re-create and re-import signing keys onto a new server, but I wouldn't rely on it. You'll probably end up with broken clients for ages. You'll also definitely run into loads of clients 404ing on your server, trying to download media that no longer exists. Personally, if I'd lose access to my server, I'd just start over with a new domain and get my backups in order that time. If you have backups you can recover, you can get everything up and running painlessly by pointing DNS to the new server and waiting for DNS propagation to finish. As for moving between hosters, there's a tool for that: https://ems.element.io/tools/matrix-migration https://ems.element.io/tools/matrix-migration; it's a tool that'll invite your new account into every room your old account was part of, transfer profile pictures and such and optionally kick the old client from rooms after migrations. That'll only help if your new account is on a different server, though.
MayeulC 5y ago
I think this scenario isn't handled too well, and I'm afraid servers that have seen your previous server will refuse to talk with it, and continue spamming the old address. Make sure to backup your server's private key so that you can properly leave rooms. It's usually better to leave all rooms prior to decommissioning a server, too, but I am not 100% sure it would prevent that issue.
jimmygrapes 5y ago
A migration guide would be much appreciated. I'd also like them to name homeserver.yaml in the Synapse Debian package to something akin to homeserver.example.yaml so that updates don't make me have to diff changes to figure out what I need to add (since accepting the package version overwriting my homeserver url is unacceptable). But that's neither here nor there.
- stevenicr 5y ago
  I asked about migration guide in the chat a couple weeks ago. Found 2-3 on random internet sites that made it sound too easy - so I was expecting some gotchas to be mentioned, but got crickets. I will be trying to migrate to a new server at different host/data center in about a week - hope it's as simple as the base guides I bookmarked make it sound. Definitely would love an official guide and some kind of check things script maybe - but we'll see, maybe it's not too hard - dunno yet.
  - jakecopp 5y ago
    I'd love to hear how this goes if you are interested in writing a blog (or comment!)

jeroenhd 5y ago

I believe federation recovery should be possible assuming you have access to the server's signing key. Without it, you'll probably run into conflicts. You'll definitely have problems with missing rooms, missing user encryption, the lot of it. I think it should be possible to re-create and re-import signing keys onto a new server, but I wouldn't rely on it. You'll probably end up with broken clients for ages. You'll also definitely run into loads of clients 404ing on your server, trying to download media that no longer exists. Personally, if I'd lose access to my server, I'd just start over with a new domain and get my backups in order that time. If you have backups you can recover, you can get everything up and running painlessly by pointing DNS to the new server and waiting for DNS propagation to finish. As for moving between hosters, there's a tool for that: https://ems.element.io/tools/matrix-migration https://ems.element.io/tools/matrix-migration; it's a tool that'll invite your new account into every room your old account was part of, transfer profile pictures and such and optionally kick the old client from rooms after migrations. That'll only help if your new account is on a different server, though.

MayeulC 5y ago

I think this scenario isn't handled too well, and I'm afraid servers that have seen your previous server will refuse to talk with it, and continue spamming the old address. Make sure to backup your server's private key so that you can properly leave rooms. It's usually better to leave all rooms prior to decommissioning a server, too, but I am not 100% sure it would prevent that issue.

jimmygrapes 5y ago

A migration guide would be much appreciated. I'd also like them to name homeserver.yaml in the Synapse Debian package to something akin to homeserver.example.yaml so that updates don't make me have to diff changes to figure out what I need to add (since accepting the package version overwriting my homeserver url is unacceptable). But that's neither here nor there.

stevenicr 5y ago
I asked about migration guide in the chat a couple weeks ago. Found 2-3 on random internet sites that made it sound too easy - so I was expecting some gotchas to be mentioned, but got crickets. I will be trying to migrate to a new server at different host/data center in about a week - hope it's as simple as the base guides I bookmarked make it sound. Definitely would love an official guide and some kind of check things script maybe - but we'll see, maybe it's not too hard - dunno yet.
- jakecopp 5y ago
  I'd love to hear how this goes if you are interested in writing a blog (or comment!)