7 ms·

Linux is Valve's lifeboat for the case Microsoft starts misbehaving.

by marcodiego 5y ago

pjmlp 5y ago
Good luck with that, Steam Machine were selling like hot cakes.
- meibo 5y ago
  The Deck certainly is, it's sold out into 2023. People want PC games on the go, Valve provides it in a now common form factor, at a reasonable price, with a trusted name.
  - pjmlp 5y ago
    If I only make 5 units of something, I can state it is sold out as well, yet it won't take the market by storm. Lots of things sold out, what matters is sustainability.
    - AnIdiotOnTheNet 5y ago
      Not really sure why you were downvoted here, production capacity is certainly an issue with Steam Decks.
      - pjmlp 5y ago
        I will get downvoted for every remark made against Steam and the dream of Linux taking over the world of AAA games (originally written for DirectX/Windows anyway). God forbid to talk against the Valve mob.
      - Zhyl 5y ago
        But the case being argued is demand for the Steam Deck which is demonstrably high. The counter point to that was that production was low, therefore selling out doesn't mean much. However, the Steam Machines didn't sell out at all so at the very least there is more interest in the Steam Deck than Steam Machines. Sure, it doesn't follow that the Steam Deck will necessarily be a success, but the GP's arguments seem lazy and bad faith, which is presumably why they are being downvoted.
      - MayeulC 5y ago
        A contrarian and provocative tone like this invites downvotes, I'd prefer to see this discussion remain constructive instead of throwing accusations and hyperboles that derail into a flamewar. Given the low-effort content of these replies, I would consider that trolling. I do not completely disagree with the parent though. We did not get exact figures, and in my circles, only die-hard geeks have heard of the Steam Deck, even regular gamers who spend a lot of time on Steam didn't know what it was. Granted, I asked them just a little after the announcement. Anyway, I am not sure valve is trying to rival Nintendo here. They probably want Steam Deck to become profitable, and I think they would welcome competitors who come up with Steam Deck alternatives, especially as SteamOS becomes available.
    - harporoeder 5y ago
      At least 110 thousand units were preordered on the first day [1]. I agree being sold out is not sufficient evidence of popularity but that is not the only evidence. 1: https://arstechnica.com/gaming/2021/07/html-holes-provide-a-glimpse-of-steam-decks-initial-preorder-numbers/ https://arstechnica.com/gaming/2021/07/html-holes-provide-a-...
      - pjmlp 5y ago
        110 units per day? It is going to take the world, how I failed to see that. Nintendo better watch out, https://www.statista.com/statistics/687059/nintendo-switch-unit-sales-worldwide/ https://www.statista.com/statistics/687059/nintendo-switch-u...
        MayeulC 5y ago
        thousand. 110 thousand. This is a low estimate, that covers the first 90 minutes of preorders. The source that was linked contains details.
  - blitzar 5y ago
    > The Deck certainly is, it's sold out into 2023. The first ones might not drop by then either? Until the first deliveries drop it is just vapourware.
- InitialLastName 5y ago
  The Steam Machine was very effective at convincing MS not to lock down 3rd-party app marketplaces (as they were threatening to do before it came out). It was really more of a threat than a sincere attempt at a commercial product.
  - pjmlp 5y ago
    What convinced Microsoft was the failure of UWP apps, not Valve.
- seabird 5y ago
  Whether or not Steam Machines sold well or not is irrelevant. They were an intermediary step to them not being beholden to an OS vendor. In the last couple of years, they have arrived at their destination -- games run on Linux unless they have anticheat that prevents then from running on Linux. If they overcome the anticheat hurdle and reach 100% of top games running with decent performance, there are plenty of people who have a computer that they use exclusively for video games and web apps that will gladly forego paying for Windows.
  - pjmlp 5y ago
    They are relevant as they were released with the same kind of party "we will take Windows down!", lets see how much the people actually learned from history.
    - marcodiego 5y ago
      > They are relevant as they were released with the same kind of party "we will take Windows down!" I really don't think that was the case. This one, OTOH, was: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Icng5MHp7T4 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Icng5MHp7T4
      - pjmlp 5y ago
        Here is a refresher, https://www.pcworld.com/article/423973/hands-on-with-alienwares-steam-machine-valves-vanguard-for-pc-gaming-in-the-living-room.html https://www.pcworld.com/article/423973/hands-on-with-alienwa...
        marcodiego 5y ago
        Strongest part of the article seems to be "Call it Valve’s middle finger to Windows", which is author's comment. AFAIR, Gabe Newell didn't like MS policies with windows 8, but I never got the feeling of SteamOS release being anything close to "we will take Windows down!".
    - seabird 5y ago
- marcodiego 5y ago
  Hi pjmlp! Please take this as sincere advice: avoid comments that show contempt and disdain. They're disrespectful, distract discussion from main points and are not good for you or anybody else. It's not the first time I'm a target of such comments from you.
  - pjmlp 5y ago
    I fail to see any of that on the comment....
    - marcodiego 5y ago
      > Good luck with that, Steam Machine were selling like hot cakes. I assume you write "Steam Machine were selling like hot cakes" using irony and sarcasm. At the same time "Good luck with that" is like a recommendation on something you guess will fail or merely derogatory. So, yes, your comment shows disdain and contempt.
      - pjmlp 5y ago
        Still see no issue with the comment, irony and sarcasm are part of our world and literature tools used by famous writers.
        Zhyl 5y ago
        Irony and sarcasm aren't conducive to healthy discussion, though. Ultimately if I'm going to show respect to you as a participant I would expect to have respect shown in return. In terms of your actual contribution to discussion it means your points are weak and easy to counter.
        marcodiego 5y ago
        Thanks! You said it much better than I could.
        pjmlp 5y ago

Linux is Valve's lifeboat for the case Microsoft starts misbehaving.

pjmlp 5y ago

Good luck with that, Steam Machine were selling like hot cakes.

meibo 5y ago
The Deck certainly is, it's sold out into 2023. People want PC games on the go, Valve provides it in a now common form factor, at a reasonable price, with a trusted name.
- pjmlp 5y ago
  If I only make 5 units of something, I can state it is sold out as well, yet it won't take the market by storm. Lots of things sold out, what matters is sustainability.
  - AnIdiotOnTheNet 5y ago
    Not really sure why you were downvoted here, production capacity is certainly an issue with Steam Decks.
    - pjmlp 5y ago
      I will get downvoted for every remark made against Steam and the dream of Linux taking over the world of AAA games (originally written for DirectX/Windows anyway). God forbid to talk against the Valve mob.
    - Zhyl 5y ago
      But the case being argued is demand for the Steam Deck which is demonstrably high. The counter point to that was that production was low, therefore selling out doesn't mean much. However, the Steam Machines didn't sell out at all so at the very least there is more interest in the Steam Deck than Steam Machines. Sure, it doesn't follow that the Steam Deck will necessarily be a success, but the GP's arguments seem lazy and bad faith, which is presumably why they are being downvoted.
    - MayeulC 5y ago
      A contrarian and provocative tone like this invites downvotes, I'd prefer to see this discussion remain constructive instead of throwing accusations and hyperboles that derail into a flamewar. Given the low-effort content of these replies, I would consider that trolling. I do not completely disagree with the parent though. We did not get exact figures, and in my circles, only die-hard geeks have heard of the Steam Deck, even regular gamers who spend a lot of time on Steam didn't know what it was. Granted, I asked them just a little after the announcement. Anyway, I am not sure valve is trying to rival Nintendo here. They probably want Steam Deck to become profitable, and I think they would welcome competitors who come up with Steam Deck alternatives, especially as SteamOS becomes available.
  - harporoeder 5y ago
    At least 110 thousand units were preordered on the first day [1]. I agree being sold out is not sufficient evidence of popularity but that is not the only evidence. 1: https://arstechnica.com/gaming/2021/07/html-holes-provide-a-glimpse-of-steam-decks-initial-preorder-numbers/ https://arstechnica.com/gaming/2021/07/html-holes-provide-a-...
    - pjmlp 5y ago
      110 units per day? It is going to take the world, how I failed to see that. Nintendo better watch out, https://www.statista.com/statistics/687059/nintendo-switch-unit-sales-worldwide/ https://www.statista.com/statistics/687059/nintendo-switch-u...
      - MayeulC 5y ago
        thousand. 110 thousand. This is a low estimate, that covers the first 90 minutes of preorders. The source that was linked contains details.
- blitzar 5y ago
  > The Deck certainly is, it's sold out into 2023. The first ones might not drop by then either? Until the first deliveries drop it is just vapourware.
InitialLastName 5y ago
The Steam Machine was very effective at convincing MS not to lock down 3rd-party app marketplaces (as they were threatening to do before it came out). It was really more of a threat than a sincere attempt at a commercial product.
- pjmlp 5y ago
  What convinced Microsoft was the failure of UWP apps, not Valve.
seabird 5y ago
Whether or not Steam Machines sold well or not is irrelevant. They were an intermediary step to them not being beholden to an OS vendor. In the last couple of years, they have arrived at their destination -- games run on Linux unless they have anticheat that prevents then from running on Linux. If they overcome the anticheat hurdle and reach 100% of top games running with decent performance, there are plenty of people who have a computer that they use exclusively for video games and web apps that will gladly forego paying for Windows.
- pjmlp 5y ago
  They are relevant as they were released with the same kind of party "we will take Windows down!", lets see how much the people actually learned from history.
  - marcodiego 5y ago
    > They are relevant as they were released with the same kind of party "we will take Windows down!" I really don't think that was the case. This one, OTOH, was: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Icng5MHp7T4 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Icng5MHp7T4
    - pjmlp 5y ago
      Here is a refresher, https://www.pcworld.com/article/423973/hands-on-with-alienwares-steam-machine-valves-vanguard-for-pc-gaming-in-the-living-room.html https://www.pcworld.com/article/423973/hands-on-with-alienwa...
      - marcodiego 5y ago
        Strongest part of the article seems to be "Call it Valve’s middle finger to Windows", which is author's comment. AFAIR, Gabe Newell didn't like MS policies with windows 8, but I never got the feeling of SteamOS release being anything close to "we will take Windows down!".
  - seabird 5y ago
marcodiego 5y ago
Hi pjmlp! Please take this as sincere advice: avoid comments that show contempt and disdain. They're disrespectful, distract discussion from main points and are not good for you or anybody else. It's not the first time I'm a target of such comments from you.
- pjmlp 5y ago
  I fail to see any of that on the comment....
  - marcodiego 5y ago
    > Good luck with that, Steam Machine were selling like hot cakes. I assume you write "Steam Machine were selling like hot cakes" using irony and sarcasm. At the same time "Good luck with that" is like a recommendation on something you guess will fail or merely derogatory. So, yes, your comment shows disdain and contempt.
    - pjmlp 5y ago
      Still see no issue with the comment, irony and sarcasm are part of our world and literature tools used by famous writers.
      - Zhyl 5y ago
        Irony and sarcasm aren't conducive to healthy discussion, though. Ultimately if I'm going to show respect to you as a participant I would expect to have respect shown in return. In terms of your actual contribution to discussion it means your points are weak and easy to counter.
        marcodiego 5y ago
        Thanks! You said it much better than I could.
        pjmlp 5y ago