5 ms·

How to develop black and white film at home with coffee (2019)

198 points by nanna 5y ago

dhosek 5y ago
My grandfather had a darkroom in his basement where he taught me to develop B/W film and make prints. I have no doubt that he would have leapt at this as a means to cut down his costs (part of our Bohemian heritage—the stereotype, which lived up to reality in my experience, being that our people are rather, um, thrifty). He had already eschewed stop bath for diluted white vinegar. Having access to a darkroom outside of school was a remarkably handy thing back then.
rolivercoffee 5y ago
There's quite a nice James Hoffmann video covering this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9bhOtTUtPhg https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9bhOtTUtPhg
asciimov 5y ago
FYI: it is not really mentioned, but for better results use actual B&W film, not color process B&W or Color film. Also, use new film with this and don't expect great results your first few times.
deleted 5y ago
[deleted]
alexellisuk 5y ago
I had lots of fun developing Black and White film with commercial chemicals. They are cheap enough, but do expire. Caffenol works reasonably well, and because it's made from dry ingredients doesn't really go off. The main issues I had were around the reels for loading film ready for the tank. 26-frame rolls were usually fine, but 26-frame often buckled. Stainless Steel reels were much worse and stuck together. For sale if anyone is interested!
ikorin 5y ago
sydthrowaway 5y ago
Now do colour without toxins
refurb 5y ago
Maybe it’s because I worked as a chemist for a bit, but photographic chemistry is absolutely fascinating and gets very high tech when you get into color and things like Polaroid. Gives you a real appreciation for the technological powerhouse that Kodak was in its prime.
- rbobby 5y ago
  Polaroids (self developing color pictures) are a good example of everyday magic. Sure it's chemistry and not magic, but how sure are you? If magic was real, wouldn't those who knew how to use it figure out how to profit off it on a wide scale? Flying carpets? Too much time investment for too few trips. Aluminum "wings" that fooled even Bernoulli... no there's a business that continues to make billions. DNA testing? Don't get me started about prepackaged identity spells. :)
- klodolph 5y ago
  I think color films in general are a miracle of modern chemistry. Agfa and Fuji deserve credit as the other major companies which produced high-quality color films, alongside Kodak and Polaroid. Unfortunately, these companies had to set up supply chains for manufacture of the necessary chemicals, and those supply chains run the risk of evaporating as the demand for film declines. Polaroid already fell to this... you can't buy Polaroid film any more, and it can't be manufactured, because the required chemicals are simply not available. The production line has been purchased and restarted but it's not the same film.
  - i_am_proteus 5y ago
    Another process that's been lost is Cibachrome/Ilfochrome. Direct positive color dye emulsion, made to be printed from chrome film or exposed as a direct positive. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ilfochrome https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ilfochrome RA-4 color paper, on the other hand, is alive and well; most of it gets used for digital prints, exposed by laser printer and then developed.
- iNerdier 5y ago
  Both Polaroid and Kodak were scientific powerhouses. The original integral film camera, the SX-70, utilised loads of new technology for the time, including flat flex cables and microcontroller commanded shutters. Much of it seems fairly rudimentary in comparison for what we can do now but I’m always amazed that they figured this stuff out 50+ years ago. Edwin Land who started the company was an incredible talent and is really worth reading up on.
canbus 5y ago
Cool. My dad and I have taken up film photography fairly recently, myself using a Nikon F55 which lets me use all my digital lenses, and him using an old Kodak Brownie that he grew up with. He had a heart attack about a year ago and shooting on film seems to give him a nostalgia trip that calms him down. Strangely it does the same for me too. We'll have to give this a go together!
- dekoruotas 5y ago
  Film photography is certainly the best hobby that I've picked up during the lockdown. Try getting some vintage lenses and mounting them on a digital camera via an adapter for great results too.
- thread_id 5y ago
  I started photography in my teens with a Brownie that my mother gave me. I had several friends who shared the same hobby. We put together a dark room and developed the films ourselves. It was great fun. I have fond memories.
giantg2 5y ago
I might shave to shoot some film soon just to try it out. Been about 3 years since I've shot/developed film.
- AccountToUse 5y ago
  It's had a huge revival the past two years. I got into it about seven years ago when it was still niche/"who shoots film anymore? Just get a sony a7!". Now the photography community has had a huge backlash against digital, especially in the hobby space. Now it's very fashionable. Pretty ironic since the biggest destination for it is just Instagram, where it's a pixelated square but alas. The plus side is that the revived interest has led to more companies and people making and selling cool film stuff. New film types, accessories, labs opening. The biggest downside is that prices go up to match demand. Good film cameras are no longer being produced. There's a limited supply out there. And Kodak (the best color film producer, nothing beats Ektar 100) price increases are only matched by price increases at your lab to develop and get prints. Film photography is an amazing hobby. It's a really fun artistic outlet that just about anybody can learn a lot about themselves with. You shoot for a year or two an you'll learn you have a style you like taking most. Maybe black and white architecture. Maybe golden hour landscapes. Rarely do other hobbies make you learn about your tastes as such.
  - giantg2 5y ago
    I'm not very good. Maybe partially lack of experience. I think I mostly have some 400TX and Fomapan. I think I have some Fuji 400 something for color. I have some dry developer too. Probably have to use it up fairly soon before it gets too old. I develop the negatives, but then scan them using a photo scanner.
chobobro 5y ago
I've developed some 4x5 Tri-x 320 film with caffenol-c and ilford rapid fixer and the results were good[0]. No scratches or grain but that might be due to the large format and not needing to agitate in a tank. My development time was 11 minutes which i guessed from these experimental times [1]. [0] https://imgur.com/a/qGeEkdw https://imgur.com/a/qGeEkdw [1] https://www.caffenol.org/film-development-chart/ https://www.caffenol.org/film-development-chart/
- klodolph 5y ago
  You'd need to make some damn large prints to see the grain in a Tri-X 4x5. My general feeling is that 8x10 where you see grain in a 35mm negative, so 32x40 is where you'd see grain in a 4x5 negative. "Where you see grain" is a bit subjective, of course.
  - ghaff 5y ago
    That sounds about right. Depends what speed you shoot the Tri-X though. At 400 the grain typically isn't bad. But get up to 1600 which is about the practical max and the grain is getting obvious at 8x10.
- i_am_proteus 5y ago
  I've had similar results with 4x5" 320TXP. Some grain showed up on 35mm 400TX so my guess is the enlarging factor is what kept the large format film grain-free. I see the same effect using traditional developers. Ultimately I didn't find any value-add with caffenol, since it still needs to be fixed, and the fixer needs to be disposed of properly. Plus, the results are better with Ilfosol 3 or HC-110 stand development.
nanna 5y ago
Anyone have experience developing 8mm film in caffenol?
- i_am_proteus 5y ago
  The size of the film doesn't matter, only the emulsion. This process is for B&W negative film emulsions. It will work okay with many other film emulsions, but the result will be a B&W negative.
- mmcwilliams 5y ago
  I've done a fair bit of developing with caffenol and beerol and a combination of the two on moviefilm, mostly 16mm but the process is the same. Volume of the developer is the issue. Works best in a bucket with 2 liters of developer per 400ft of material to prevent exhaustion. I personally like the combination of the traditional caffenol recipe combined with Dagie Brundert's beerol recipe. 1L of water (warm) 100g (20 tsp) washing soda 30g (6 tsp) vitamin C 60g (12 tsp) instant coffee 1L beer On something like Tri-X I'll use a dev time ranging from 15-20 min that I determine after testing. It's a nice balance in contrast between the two developers.
  - nanna 5y ago
    Brilliant. 2 litres developer per 400ft of material seems a bit little though, no? > I personally like the combination of the traditional caffenol recipe combined with Dagie Brundert's beerol recipe. How comes, out of interest?
    - mmcwilliams 5y ago
      For me beerol doesn't get to the density I'm looking for and caffenol, depending on a few factors, will result in a relatively high-contrast negative. The combined recipe is similar to a stock D-76 or ID-11 in terms of conventional developers. 200ft/L is a conservative estimate and I have been a part of workshops where we developed 1000ft per gallon, so YMMV. Checking my notes it looks like I processed reversal last time I did 4 rolls and so each roll would have been developed twice, essentially.
devb 5y ago
I've developed direct positive paper with caffenol in order to get a nice sepia tone. In my experience, caffenol smells terrible. If you do decide to experiment with it (and you should) I would recommend getting the absolute cheapest instant coffee you can find. The acid in robusto beans helps the reaction along. If you're looking for a non-toxic commercial developer, Kodak's Xtol developer is based on ascorbic acid.
analog31 5y ago
I had to look up washing soda. It's sodium carbonate, aka soda ash. Its other use is an additive that reduces the melting point of glass and makes it more workable.
h3mb3 5y ago
For anyone interested, Technology Connections recently released two interesting videos covering B&W film development [1] and photographic printing [2] at home. Iirc he also mentioned Caffenol at some point. I find this stuff super interesting. I recently got into film photography a little but haven't really considered developing the negatives myself, mainly due to our small apartment. Maybe some day. [1] https://youtu.be/WpgsITqoDXQ https://youtu.be/WpgsITqoDXQ [2] https://youtu.be/AQC2WsvHdqw https://youtu.be/AQC2WsvHdqw
- ghaff 5y ago
  Developing B&W 35mm negatives is pretty straightforward and doesn't require much room or gear. It's also the uninteresting part of the process. (Aside from playing with chemistry.) I had the rest of the equipment for printing from high school days but, after having good darkrooms in college/graduate school, I set things up in a half bath in my apartment and it was all more trouble than it was worth. By the time I got a house, there still wasn't a good place to setup a darkroom and digital was on the cusp of coming in.
trop 5y ago
There's some history of "organic" or at least "natural" ingredients in photography. See, for example, the early "autochrome" color process. It uses dyed potato starch as color filters. Lampblack (granted a petro-byproduct) separated the potato bits. The plate is coated with shellac (secreted by the female lac bug).[1][2] Other big photo ingredients, past and present, include egg whites (for albumen prints)[3], gum arabic (sap of acacia tree, for emulsions), and cow/pig hooves (gelatin, for the emulsion)[4]. And, of course, the alchemist's favorites: gold, silver, platinum, palladium... What I'd take from this is that we're used to technologies involving highly refined/synthesized substances with fancy names. But so many 19th century processes were done with more day-to-day substances, and we're still partaking of those technologies. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Autochrome_Lumi%C3%A8re https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Autochrome_Lumi%C3%A8re [2] https://www.lensrentals.com/blog/2019/05/how-potatoes-and-gelatin-created-color-photography/ https://www.lensrentals.com/blog/2019/05/how-potatoes-and-ge... [3] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Albumen_print https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Albumen_print [4] https://petapixel.com/2011/11/15/did-you-know-film-and-photo-paper-are-made-using-animals-parts/ https://petapixel.com/2011/11/15/did-you-know-film-and-photo...
- peterburkimsher 5y ago
  Thank you trop for the links! Do you know if there's a database of natural chemicals for filters? Specifically, I'm looking for a 0.3 µm ultraviolet filter (or any base-2 harmonic e.g. 2 * 0.3 = 0.6µm, 4x, 8x, 16x). Tangentially related, I'm also searching for any flowers whose pollen grains are 19.2 µm (0.3 µm * 64). As you say, the 19th-century (and Ancient Greek, Chinese, Egyptian, IVC) experts knew well about the biological solutions for technical questions. I just have no idea where to learn about natural substances.
  - trop 5y ago
    peterburkmisher: I wish I knew! I've been wondering about all this myself, and where even this knowledge lies these days. Materials scientists? Chemists? It sees a question too specialized for the former, and not specialized enough for the latter? Please anyone who knows...? More generally: Josef Maria Eder's "History of Photography" [1] is a semi-technical survey of 19th and early 20th century processes. Part of what it makes it wonderful is the narratives of so many chemist/photographers trying to get their discoveries supported by scientific societies and/or the market, with vastly varying success. As Eder was actually there doing the work[2], he has much to recount. Much more recent, Richard Benson's "The Printed Picture"[3] takes on how images have made their way to paper. Benson probably knew as much about this as anyone still alive.[4] If in Philadelphia, it's possible still to catch an exhibition of his work.[5] [1] https://archive.org/details/EderHistoryPhotography https://archive.org/details/EderHistoryPhotography [2] https://www.metmuseum.org/art/collection/search/296322 https://www.metmuseum.org/art/collection/search/296322 is a beautiful example [3] http://www.worldcat.org/oclc/495363201 http://www.worldcat.org/oclc/495363201 [4] https://printedpicture.artgallery.yale.edu/color-photography https://printedpicture.artgallery.yale.edu/color-photography [5] https://philamuseum.org/calendar/exhibition/richard-benson-world-smarter-you-are https://philamuseum.org/calendar/exhibition/richard-benson-w...
worldmerge 5y ago
Very cool! What happens to color film if you use this process on it?
- seszett 5y ago
  Colour film gives the same results as black and white film when developed with the black and white process, except for the orange base. IMO it's not really an interesting thing to do unless you don't have a choice.
- devb 5y ago
  Color film is based on silver halides but has built-in dye couplers and filters to represent the color details. Any color film developed with chemicals intended for black and white film will come out as black and white film. There is a Flickr group dedicated to the practice: https://www.flickr.com/groups/c41inbw/pool/ https://www.flickr.com/groups/c41inbw/pool/

198 points by nanna 5y ago

My grandfather had a darkroom in his basement where he taught me to develop B/W film and make prints. I have no doubt that he would have leapt at this as a means to cut down his costs (part of our Bohemian heritage—the stereotype, which lived up to reality in my experience, being that our people are rather, um, thrifty). He had already eschewed stop bath for diluted white vinegar. Having access to a darkroom outside of school was a remarkably handy thing back then.

rolivercoffee 5y ago

There's quite a nice James Hoffmann video covering this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9bhOtTUtPhg https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9bhOtTUtPhg

asciimov 5y ago

FYI: it is not really mentioned, but for better results use actual B&W film, not color process B&W or Color film. Also, use new film with this and don't expect great results your first few times.

deleted 5y ago

[deleted]

alexellisuk 5y ago

I had lots of fun developing Black and White film with commercial chemicals. They are cheap enough, but do expire. Caffenol works reasonably well, and because it's made from dry ingredients doesn't really go off. The main issues I had were around the reels for loading film ready for the tank. 26-frame rolls were usually fine, but 26-frame often buckled. Stainless Steel reels were much worse and stuck together. For sale if anyone is interested!

ikorin 5y ago

sydthrowaway 5y ago

Now do colour without toxins

refurb 5y ago

Maybe it’s because I worked as a chemist for a bit, but photographic chemistry is absolutely fascinating and gets very high tech when you get into color and things like Polaroid. Gives you a real appreciation for the technological powerhouse that Kodak was in its prime.

rbobby 5y ago
Polaroids (self developing color pictures) are a good example of everyday magic. Sure it's chemistry and not magic, but how sure are you? If magic was real, wouldn't those who knew how to use it figure out how to profit off it on a wide scale? Flying carpets? Too much time investment for too few trips. Aluminum "wings" that fooled even Bernoulli... no there's a business that continues to make billions. DNA testing? Don't get me started about prepackaged identity spells. :)
klodolph 5y ago
I think color films in general are a miracle of modern chemistry. Agfa and Fuji deserve credit as the other major companies which produced high-quality color films, alongside Kodak and Polaroid. Unfortunately, these companies had to set up supply chains for manufacture of the necessary chemicals, and those supply chains run the risk of evaporating as the demand for film declines. Polaroid already fell to this... you can't buy Polaroid film any more, and it can't be manufactured, because the required chemicals are simply not available. The production line has been purchased and restarted but it's not the same film.
- i_am_proteus 5y ago
  Another process that's been lost is Cibachrome/Ilfochrome. Direct positive color dye emulsion, made to be printed from chrome film or exposed as a direct positive. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ilfochrome https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ilfochrome RA-4 color paper, on the other hand, is alive and well; most of it gets used for digital prints, exposed by laser printer and then developed.
iNerdier 5y ago
Both Polaroid and Kodak were scientific powerhouses. The original integral film camera, the SX-70, utilised loads of new technology for the time, including flat flex cables and microcontroller commanded shutters. Much of it seems fairly rudimentary in comparison for what we can do now but I’m always amazed that they figured this stuff out 50+ years ago. Edwin Land who started the company was an incredible talent and is really worth reading up on.

canbus 5y ago

Cool. My dad and I have taken up film photography fairly recently, myself using a Nikon F55 which lets me use all my digital lenses, and him using an old Kodak Brownie that he grew up with. He had a heart attack about a year ago and shooting on film seems to give him a nostalgia trip that calms him down. Strangely it does the same for me too. We'll have to give this a go together!

dekoruotas 5y ago
Film photography is certainly the best hobby that I've picked up during the lockdown. Try getting some vintage lenses and mounting them on a digital camera via an adapter for great results too.
thread_id 5y ago
I started photography in my teens with a Brownie that my mother gave me. I had several friends who shared the same hobby. We put together a dark room and developed the films ourselves. It was great fun. I have fond memories.

giantg2 5y ago

I might shave to shoot some film soon just to try it out. Been about 3 years since I've shot/developed film.

AccountToUse 5y ago
It's had a huge revival the past two years. I got into it about seven years ago when it was still niche/"who shoots film anymore? Just get a sony a7!". Now the photography community has had a huge backlash against digital, especially in the hobby space. Now it's very fashionable. Pretty ironic since the biggest destination for it is just Instagram, where it's a pixelated square but alas. The plus side is that the revived interest has led to more companies and people making and selling cool film stuff. New film types, accessories, labs opening. The biggest downside is that prices go up to match demand. Good film cameras are no longer being produced. There's a limited supply out there. And Kodak (the best color film producer, nothing beats Ektar 100) price increases are only matched by price increases at your lab to develop and get prints. Film photography is an amazing hobby. It's a really fun artistic outlet that just about anybody can learn a lot about themselves with. You shoot for a year or two an you'll learn you have a style you like taking most. Maybe black and white architecture. Maybe golden hour landscapes. Rarely do other hobbies make you learn about your tastes as such.
- giantg2 5y ago
  I'm not very good. Maybe partially lack of experience. I think I mostly have some 400TX and Fomapan. I think I have some Fuji 400 something for color. I have some dry developer too. Probably have to use it up fairly soon before it gets too old. I develop the negatives, but then scan them using a photo scanner.

chobobro 5y ago

I've developed some 4x5 Tri-x 320 film with caffenol-c and ilford rapid fixer and the results were good[0]. No scratches or grain but that might be due to the large format and not needing to agitate in a tank. My development time was 11 minutes which i guessed from these experimental times [1]. [0] https://imgur.com/a/qGeEkdw https://imgur.com/a/qGeEkdw [1] https://www.caffenol.org/film-development-chart/ https://www.caffenol.org/film-development-chart/

klodolph 5y ago
You'd need to make some damn large prints to see the grain in a Tri-X 4x5. My general feeling is that 8x10 where you see grain in a 35mm negative, so 32x40 is where you'd see grain in a 4x5 negative. "Where you see grain" is a bit subjective, of course.
- ghaff 5y ago
  That sounds about right. Depends what speed you shoot the Tri-X though. At 400 the grain typically isn't bad. But get up to 1600 which is about the practical max and the grain is getting obvious at 8x10.
i_am_proteus 5y ago
I've had similar results with 4x5" 320TXP. Some grain showed up on 35mm 400TX so my guess is the enlarging factor is what kept the large format film grain-free. I see the same effect using traditional developers. Ultimately I didn't find any value-add with caffenol, since it still needs to be fixed, and the fixer needs to be disposed of properly. Plus, the results are better with Ilfosol 3 or HC-110 stand development.

nanna 5y ago

Anyone have experience developing 8mm film in caffenol?

i_am_proteus 5y ago
The size of the film doesn't matter, only the emulsion. This process is for B&W negative film emulsions. It will work okay with many other film emulsions, but the result will be a B&W negative.
mmcwilliams 5y ago
I've done a fair bit of developing with caffenol and beerol and a combination of the two on moviefilm, mostly 16mm but the process is the same. Volume of the developer is the issue. Works best in a bucket with 2 liters of developer per 400ft of material to prevent exhaustion. I personally like the combination of the traditional caffenol recipe combined with Dagie Brundert's beerol recipe. 1L of water (warm) 100g (20 tsp) washing soda 30g (6 tsp) vitamin C 60g (12 tsp) instant coffee 1L beer On something like Tri-X I'll use a dev time ranging from 15-20 min that I determine after testing. It's a nice balance in contrast between the two developers.
- nanna 5y ago
  Brilliant. 2 litres developer per 400ft of material seems a bit little though, no? > I personally like the combination of the traditional caffenol recipe combined with Dagie Brundert's beerol recipe. How comes, out of interest?
  - mmcwilliams 5y ago
    For me beerol doesn't get to the density I'm looking for and caffenol, depending on a few factors, will result in a relatively high-contrast negative. The combined recipe is similar to a stock D-76 or ID-11 in terms of conventional developers. 200ft/L is a conservative estimate and I have been a part of workshops where we developed 1000ft per gallon, so YMMV. Checking my notes it looks like I processed reversal last time I did 4 rolls and so each roll would have been developed twice, essentially.

devb 5y ago

I've developed direct positive paper with caffenol in order to get a nice sepia tone. In my experience, caffenol smells terrible. If you do decide to experiment with it (and you should) I would recommend getting the absolute cheapest instant coffee you can find. The acid in robusto beans helps the reaction along. If you're looking for a non-toxic commercial developer, Kodak's Xtol developer is based on ascorbic acid.

analog31 5y ago

I had to look up washing soda. It's sodium carbonate, aka soda ash. Its other use is an additive that reduces the melting point of glass and makes it more workable.

h3mb3 5y ago

For anyone interested, Technology Connections recently released two interesting videos covering B&W film development [1] and photographic printing [2] at home. Iirc he also mentioned Caffenol at some point. I find this stuff super interesting. I recently got into film photography a little but haven't really considered developing the negatives myself, mainly due to our small apartment. Maybe some day. [1] https://youtu.be/WpgsITqoDXQ https://youtu.be/WpgsITqoDXQ [2] https://youtu.be/AQC2WsvHdqw https://youtu.be/AQC2WsvHdqw

ghaff 5y ago
Developing B&W 35mm negatives is pretty straightforward and doesn't require much room or gear. It's also the uninteresting part of the process. (Aside from playing with chemistry.) I had the rest of the equipment for printing from high school days but, after having good darkrooms in college/graduate school, I set things up in a half bath in my apartment and it was all more trouble than it was worth. By the time I got a house, there still wasn't a good place to setup a darkroom and digital was on the cusp of coming in.

trop 5y ago

There's some history of "organic" or at least "natural" ingredients in photography. See, for example, the early "autochrome" color process. It uses dyed potato starch as color filters. Lampblack (granted a petro-byproduct) separated the potato bits. The plate is coated with shellac (secreted by the female lac bug).[1][2] Other big photo ingredients, past and present, include egg whites (for albumen prints)[3], gum arabic (sap of acacia tree, for emulsions), and cow/pig hooves (gelatin, for the emulsion)[4]. And, of course, the alchemist's favorites: gold, silver, platinum, palladium... What I'd take from this is that we're used to technologies involving highly refined/synthesized substances with fancy names. But so many 19th century processes were done with more day-to-day substances, and we're still partaking of those technologies. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Autochrome_Lumi%C3%A8re https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Autochrome_Lumi%C3%A8re [2] https://www.lensrentals.com/blog/2019/05/how-potatoes-and-gelatin-created-color-photography/ https://www.lensrentals.com/blog/2019/05/how-potatoes-and-ge... [3] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Albumen_print https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Albumen_print [4] https://petapixel.com/2011/11/15/did-you-know-film-and-photo-paper-are-made-using-animals-parts/ https://petapixel.com/2011/11/15/did-you-know-film-and-photo...

peterburkimsher 5y ago
Thank you trop for the links! Do you know if there's a database of natural chemicals for filters? Specifically, I'm looking for a 0.3 µm ultraviolet filter (or any base-2 harmonic e.g. 2 * 0.3 = 0.6µm, 4x, 8x, 16x). Tangentially related, I'm also searching for any flowers whose pollen grains are 19.2 µm (0.3 µm * 64). As you say, the 19th-century (and Ancient Greek, Chinese, Egyptian, IVC) experts knew well about the biological solutions for technical questions. I just have no idea where to learn about natural substances.
- trop 5y ago
  peterburkmisher: I wish I knew! I've been wondering about all this myself, and where even this knowledge lies these days. Materials scientists? Chemists? It sees a question too specialized for the former, and not specialized enough for the latter? Please anyone who knows...? More generally: Josef Maria Eder's "History of Photography" [1] is a semi-technical survey of 19th and early 20th century processes. Part of what it makes it wonderful is the narratives of so many chemist/photographers trying to get their discoveries supported by scientific societies and/or the market, with vastly varying success. As Eder was actually there doing the work[2], he has much to recount. Much more recent, Richard Benson's "The Printed Picture"[3] takes on how images have made their way to paper. Benson probably knew as much about this as anyone still alive.[4] If in Philadelphia, it's possible still to catch an exhibition of his work.[5] [1] https://archive.org/details/EderHistoryPhotography https://archive.org/details/EderHistoryPhotography [2] https://www.metmuseum.org/art/collection/search/296322 https://www.metmuseum.org/art/collection/search/296322 is a beautiful example [3] http://www.worldcat.org/oclc/495363201 http://www.worldcat.org/oclc/495363201 [4] https://printedpicture.artgallery.yale.edu/color-photography https://printedpicture.artgallery.yale.edu/color-photography [5] https://philamuseum.org/calendar/exhibition/richard-benson-world-smarter-you-are https://philamuseum.org/calendar/exhibition/richard-benson-w...

worldmerge 5y ago

Very cool! What happens to color film if you use this process on it?

seszett 5y ago
Colour film gives the same results as black and white film when developed with the black and white process, except for the orange base. IMO it's not really an interesting thing to do unless you don't have a choice.
devb 5y ago
Color film is based on silver halides but has built-in dye couplers and filters to represent the color details. Any color film developed with chemicals intended for black and white film will come out as black and white film. There is a Flickr group dedicated to the practice: https://www.flickr.com/groups/c41inbw/pool/ https://www.flickr.com/groups/c41inbw/pool/