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That's an intersting take. My only argument is with your assertion that "app developers love this". The 'stop theming my app' crowd is pretty small. The number

That's an intersting take. My only argument is with your assertion that "app developers love this". The 'stop theming my app' crowd is pretty small. The number of apps on Flatpak is pretty small compared to say Snap and tiny compared to 'traditional' package managers on distributions.

gjsman-1000 5y ago
I wouldn't call it just app theming. App developers in general love how there's now a "right way of doing things" now, but in particular, the future. You don't have to worry how each distro handles booting or services - it's SystemD. You won't have to worry how each distro handles audio with Jack, PulseAudio, or ALSA - it's PipeWire. You don't have to worry about the libraries the distro provides for your app - just use Flatpak. You don't have to worry where to host your app for every distro - just use Flathub. You don't have to worry what toolkit to use - just use GTK. You can use Qt if you really care, but GTK is clearly the "one true road" (if that analogy makes sense). And so on.
- jdright 5y ago
  All that is true, except the last point about GTK. Most developers that want their apps running everywhere picks Qt. GTK is just dead in this game and any developer picking GTK is restraining theirselves to GNU/Linux. Don't use GTK
  - kaladin-jasnah 5y ago
    The way I see it, using GTK reminds me of "native" Mac apps (like the ones written in Swift), but on Linux. GTK sure looks a hell of a lot better than Qt on a GNOME desktop: more modern, polished, and clean. So that's why I'd imagine some people choose GTK.
    - michaelmrose 5y ago
      Ironically GTK apps look better on a QT based desktop than vice versa because KDE/QT devs unlike GTK devs actually make an effort on that front. You can with minimal effort theme both similarly by installing a theme and icon theme that has versions for both gtk qt but your gnome desktop wont provide a built in gui to configure such, again their choice, their limitation not a limitation of QT. A given app QT app isn't going to pull in a particular theme because that would be the tail wagging the dog.
- LargoLasskhyfv 5y ago
  You don't have to worry about systems getting old, because you are forced to update continuosly because of all the bloat. I'm looking at PipeWire especially, and the not so flat things also. Won't open the other can of worms, not at all. kthx baiiiii
- pjmlp 5y ago
  I would agree with Gtk, if it wasn't the way they always break everything, now including Glade, because writing GtkBuilder XML files by hand is sooo much fun, everyone should embrace it.
michaelmrose 5y ago
You might as well replace app developers with gnome developers except then it wouldn't be a revelation because the project has always felt that way.
ASalazarMX 5y ago
As a long time Linux user, theming was always a sore point. It never was point and click, some programs would theme partially, or none at all. I'd welcome theme abolishing in Gnome, to offer a boring but predictable experience to casual users. I currently used KDE btw, because I like customization, but I would install a boring but predictable Gnome for casual users that want to try Linux.
- smoldesu 5y ago
  I agree, but that's still not an excuse for GNOME developers to make their apps un-themable. If they want to target a specific stylesheet or design language, they're more than welcome to do so; but their efforts to kneecap everyone else who wants native-looking apps is frankly immature.
Shared404 5y ago
> The number of apps on Flatpak is pretty small compared to say Snap and tiny compared to 'traditional' package managers on distributions. While the raw number of apps on Flatpak may be less, it's more often the apps people care about. I say this as someone who prefers native packages, except for in some specific exceptions.
1_player 5y ago
> The number of apps on Flatpak is pretty small compared to say Snap Citation needed, and number of users is more important than number of apps. Snaps are pushed strongly by Canonical and they actually pay people to port apps to their store, which is pretty much used by Ubuntu users only, while every other distro uses Flatpak. Snaps are not gonna last long, like many other Canonical-only efforts. Nobody is interested in adopting them, for good reasons. Flatpak, with their shortcomings, are more flexible, actively developed by multiple entities and adopted by more people.
- ncmncm 5y ago
  I will not miss either one, when they are both replaced by some other thing.

gjsman-1000 5y ago

I wouldn't call it just app theming. App developers in general love how there's now a "right way of doing things" now, but in particular, the future. You don't have to worry how each distro handles booting or services - it's SystemD. You won't have to worry how each distro handles audio with Jack, PulseAudio, or ALSA - it's PipeWire. You don't have to worry about the libraries the distro provides for your app - just use Flatpak. You don't have to worry where to host your app for every distro - just use Flathub. You don't have to worry what toolkit to use - just use GTK. You can use Qt if you really care, but GTK is clearly the "one true road" (if that analogy makes sense). And so on.

jdright 5y ago
All that is true, except the last point about GTK. Most developers that want their apps running everywhere picks Qt. GTK is just dead in this game and any developer picking GTK is restraining theirselves to GNU/Linux. Don't use GTK
- kaladin-jasnah 5y ago
  The way I see it, using GTK reminds me of "native" Mac apps (like the ones written in Swift), but on Linux. GTK sure looks a hell of a lot better than Qt on a GNOME desktop: more modern, polished, and clean. So that's why I'd imagine some people choose GTK.
  - michaelmrose 5y ago
    Ironically GTK apps look better on a QT based desktop than vice versa because KDE/QT devs unlike GTK devs actually make an effort on that front. You can with minimal effort theme both similarly by installing a theme and icon theme that has versions for both gtk qt but your gnome desktop wont provide a built in gui to configure such, again their choice, their limitation not a limitation of QT. A given app QT app isn't going to pull in a particular theme because that would be the tail wagging the dog.
LargoLasskhyfv 5y ago
You don't have to worry about systems getting old, because you are forced to update continuosly because of all the bloat. I'm looking at PipeWire especially, and the not so flat things also. Won't open the other can of worms, not at all. kthx baiiiii
pjmlp 5y ago
I would agree with Gtk, if it wasn't the way they always break everything, now including Glade, because writing GtkBuilder XML files by hand is sooo much fun, everyone should embrace it.

michaelmrose 5y ago

You might as well replace app developers with gnome developers except then it wouldn't be a revelation because the project has always felt that way.

ASalazarMX 5y ago

As a long time Linux user, theming was always a sore point. It never was point and click, some programs would theme partially, or none at all. I'd welcome theme abolishing in Gnome, to offer a boring but predictable experience to casual users. I currently used KDE btw, because I like customization, but I would install a boring but predictable Gnome for casual users that want to try Linux.

smoldesu 5y ago
I agree, but that's still not an excuse for GNOME developers to make their apps un-themable. If they want to target a specific stylesheet or design language, they're more than welcome to do so; but their efforts to kneecap everyone else who wants native-looking apps is frankly immature.

Shared404 5y ago

> The number of apps on Flatpak is pretty small compared to say Snap and tiny compared to 'traditional' package managers on distributions. While the raw number of apps on Flatpak may be less, it's more often the apps people care about. I say this as someone who prefers native packages, except for in some specific exceptions.

1_player 5y ago

> The number of apps on Flatpak is pretty small compared to say Snap Citation needed, and number of users is more important than number of apps. Snaps are pushed strongly by Canonical and they actually pay people to port apps to their store, which is pretty much used by Ubuntu users only, while every other distro uses Flatpak. Snaps are not gonna last long, like many other Canonical-only efforts. Nobody is interested in adopting them, for good reasons. Flatpak, with their shortcomings, are more flexible, actively developed by multiple entities and adopted by more people.

ncmncm 5y ago
I will not miss either one, when they are both replaced by some other thing.