5 ms·

Any thoughts on using React or another frontend framework with liveview?

mrdoops 5y ago
React might make sense for some specific components wired up with hooks in Liveview for real-time interactions. So if you have a complex client side component that is already available in React and you don't want to recreate it - I'd just add the JS dependency to Phoenix and embed it in a view somewhere. There are definitely complex client side interactions where integration with Liveview would be preferred, however in those cases React isn't necessarily the best option - vanilla JS or D3 or something of that nature tends to be the winning ticket. TBH I wouldn't greenfield a new web app with React if I could avoid it - either wrapping a Liveview in a React component or React in a Liveview the purpose would be to gradually transition away from React running the whole DOM/view for a large existing app. A GraphQL server with Phoenix/Absinthe for a multi-platform app web + mobile (android + ios) is reasonable but still a bigger company/team solution. React + State management like Redux is a ridiculous amount of overhead by default and I would never implement a greenfield web app that way in 2021. A Liveview interaction follows something like Backend State <query/command> Liveview <websocket> Client/Browser (where only minimal diffs of changed state is sent over the wire) and React is Backend State <query/command> Controller <JSON/HTTP> Axios <Redux/State Management> Virtual DOM <> Browser/Client (where whole json payloads are sent and encoded/decoded over the wire) Where new state means re-fetching all the state each loop instead of just what changed. The amount of data sent over the wire by default is massive with this React + HTTP/JSON model. The encoding/decoding of JSON and having to send full payloads then having state management occur in multiple places and languages - it ends up being a lot more to know and think through. The lines of code to write and amount over the wire with the classic JSON over REST + React/Redux makes it almost 100% required to have separate front/backend developers which then means coordination costs for every new feature. So TLDR; React could make sense for complex components you don't want to reinvent the wheel for or when those interactions are complex and client side. Existing web apps with a lot of React code that is too much to port over all at once can be done piece by piece (where I'd recommend heading towards handling navigation in Phoenix/Liveview and components in React).
eric4smith 5y ago
Don’t. Not necessary in 99.9999999999999% of cases and would just duplicate most functionality. And no, your app is not that 0.000000000001%
- RedBeetDeadpool 5y ago
  Just theorycrafting here, not saying I have an app that fits the description. Wouldn't you want client side statefulness if you have an app like an online spreadsheet (google sheets, microsoft excel) that could occasionally lose connection but you still want users to be able to continue working on their document?
  - mrdoops 5y ago
    Yeah offline or complex client side state management is a good use case for Javascript. There are Hooks and Push Events with Liveview for real time integrations with Liveview in those scenarios. In my experience offline requirements are rare and often in mobile scenarios where a native or Flutter-like approach is a good option. Complex client side state or collaborative features might use something like https://github.com/slab/delta-elixir https://github.com/slab/delta-elixir or https://www.inkandswitch.com/local-first/ https://www.inkandswitch.com/local-first/ which is where I'd want JS.

React might make sense for some specific components wired up with hooks in Liveview for real-time interactions. So if you have a complex client side component that is already available in React and you don't want to recreate it - I'd just add the JS dependency to Phoenix and embed it in a view somewhere. There are definitely complex client side interactions where integration with Liveview would be preferred, however in those cases React isn't necessarily the best option - vanilla JS or D3 or something of that nature tends to be the winning ticket. TBH I wouldn't greenfield a new web app with React if I could avoid it - either wrapping a Liveview in a React component or React in a Liveview the purpose would be to gradually transition away from React running the whole DOM/view for a large existing app. A GraphQL server with Phoenix/Absinthe for a multi-platform app web + mobile (android + ios) is reasonable but still a bigger company/team solution. React + State management like Redux is a ridiculous amount of overhead by default and I would never implement a greenfield web app that way in 2021. A Liveview interaction follows something like Backend State <query/command> Liveview <websocket> Client/Browser (where only minimal diffs of changed state is sent over the wire) and React is Backend State <query/command> Controller <JSON/HTTP> Axios <Redux/State Management> Virtual DOM <> Browser/Client (where whole json payloads are sent and encoded/decoded over the wire) Where new state means re-fetching all the state each loop instead of just what changed. The amount of data sent over the wire by default is massive with this React + HTTP/JSON model. The encoding/decoding of JSON and having to send full payloads then having state management occur in multiple places and languages - it ends up being a lot more to know and think through. The lines of code to write and amount over the wire with the classic JSON over REST + React/Redux makes it almost 100% required to have separate front/backend developers which then means coordination costs for every new feature. So TLDR; React could make sense for complex components you don't want to reinvent the wheel for or when those interactions are complex and client side. Existing web apps with a lot of React code that is too much to port over all at once can be done piece by piece (where I'd recommend heading towards handling navigation in Phoenix/Liveview and components in React).

eric4smith 5y ago

Don’t. Not necessary in 99.9999999999999% of cases and would just duplicate most functionality. And no, your app is not that 0.000000000001%

RedBeetDeadpool 5y ago
Just theorycrafting here, not saying I have an app that fits the description. Wouldn't you want client side statefulness if you have an app like an online spreadsheet (google sheets, microsoft excel) that could occasionally lose connection but you still want users to be able to continue working on their document?
- mrdoops 5y ago
  Yeah offline or complex client side state management is a good use case for Javascript. There are Hooks and Push Events with Liveview for real time integrations with Liveview in those scenarios. In my experience offline requirements are rare and often in mobile scenarios where a native or Flutter-like approach is a good option. Complex client side state or collaborative features might use something like https://github.com/slab/delta-elixir https://github.com/slab/delta-elixir or https://www.inkandswitch.com/local-first/ https://www.inkandswitch.com/local-first/ which is where I'd want JS.