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I am still reluctant to use JS/CSS frameworks. What I learned in 10 years is the fact that I hate learning useless abstractions that will eventually fade within

I am still reluctant to use JS/CSS frameworks. What I learned in 10 years is the fact that I hate learning useless abstractions that will eventually fade within the span of 18/36 months. The joy in web dev for me is creating stuff not learning how to use frameworks.

frankzander 5y ago
Me too. Also the frameworks deliver a lot of bloat and dependencies which can be a boomerang. For example I did some pages with bootstrap 3 ... for that I had to use a module which modifies the html templates of the CMS. Than the CMS got updated several times but the module is not been updated b/c bootstrap 3 is obsolete. But hey the there is a new module for the new cool guy in town BS 4. So you can't update the CMS or you have to rebuild a large part of the website for the sake of updates. That's totally senseless since it has no advantages for my customers. Yes I can sell it with "you must update because of security but hey nothing changes ..." - something what I would absolutely hate if it's done to me. I have my own framework - smaller and it fits my way to work. And yes I understand that this would be a other situation with a team (but then you have a guy without soul, moral and honor which is called "the sales guy" who sales everything).
vogre 5y ago
The frameworks are really stable these days. There was like one major change in React since it's beginning - introducing of hooks. But if you got in right 8 years ago, you can just sit and write a good SPA with that knowledge
- watermelon0 5y ago
  Vue.js is the only frontend framework that I have some clue about, and the first blog post when googling 'Vue 2 to 3 migration' [0] says it took them 4 man-weeks to migrate their product. From my limited experience, the main issue is that it's really hard to ensure frontend actually works as before, after upgrading frontend libraries/frameworks, outside of having really extensive end-to-end test suite. [0] https://crisp.chat/blog/vuejs-migration/ https://crisp.chat/blog/vuejs-migration/
deleted 5y ago
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frankzander 5y ago

Me too. Also the frameworks deliver a lot of bloat and dependencies which can be a boomerang. For example I did some pages with bootstrap 3 ... for that I had to use a module which modifies the html templates of the CMS. Than the CMS got updated several times but the module is not been updated b/c bootstrap 3 is obsolete. But hey the there is a new module for the new cool guy in town BS 4. So you can't update the CMS or you have to rebuild a large part of the website for the sake of updates. That's totally senseless since it has no advantages for my customers. Yes I can sell it with "you must update because of security but hey nothing changes ..." - something what I would absolutely hate if it's done to me. I have my own framework - smaller and it fits my way to work. And yes I understand that this would be a other situation with a team (but then you have a guy without soul, moral and honor which is called "the sales guy" who sales everything).

vogre 5y ago

The frameworks are really stable these days. There was like one major change in React since it's beginning - introducing of hooks. But if you got in right 8 years ago, you can just sit and write a good SPA with that knowledge

watermelon0 5y ago
Vue.js is the only frontend framework that I have some clue about, and the first blog post when googling 'Vue 2 to 3 migration' [0] says it took them 4 man-weeks to migrate their product. From my limited experience, the main issue is that it's really hard to ensure frontend actually works as before, after upgrading frontend libraries/frameworks, outside of having really extensive end-to-end test suite. [0] https://crisp.chat/blog/vuejs-migration/ https://crisp.chat/blog/vuejs-migration/

deleted 5y ago

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