4 ms·

> if they just stopped talking about Taiwan I doubt many people in the mainland would care Not at all. For a mainlander, Taiwan _is_ a region of China, think

> if they just stopped talking about Taiwan I doubt many people in the mainland would care Not at all. For a mainlander, Taiwan _is_ a region of China, think of it as Hawai for the US. People in the west see Taiwan as a separate country that China tries to forcibly absorb. People in mainland see Taiwan as a region of China that tries to be independent. Also, there is a lot of eyes on the Taiwan case from mainlanders because other regions of China are seen as potential underdogs for independence, due to cultural heritage (and wealth), such as Shangai.

dustintrex 5y ago
And the real shame is that nobody seems to care what the people in Taiwan themselves want. (Which, overwhelmingly, is to be independent and free to go their own way.)
jessaustin 5y ago
For a mainlander, Taiwan _is_ a region of China, think of it as Hawai for the US. Where I live in the Midwest USA, nobody would care if Hawai'i claimed its independence in some not-harmful-to-tourists-nor-threatening-to-military-fuel-depots fashion. That doesn't mean it would be easy. Much as was seen in the original USA annexation of Hawai'i, it is very common for interested parties to create violence where none naturally exists.
- sudosysgen 5y ago
  The issue is that Taiwan is military necessary. If the US is allowed an outpost there they will use the encirclement to threaten China's security.
  - mthoms 5y ago
    That’s a pretty bold statement. When has the US ever threatened China’s internal security?
    - sudosysgen 5y ago
      Did you forget the Cold War before Nixon? The Korean War? Even today various officials in the US military are discussion how best to militarily contain China.
      - mthoms 5y ago
        Which of those relates to Chinese internal security? In other words - aside from containing Chinese/Communist external influence, when has the US threatened China? Note: I'm not justifying or condemning any of those "external" actions by the US, I'm just curious if you can illustrate a past or ongoing threat to China proper?
        throwaway14942 5y ago
        When the Soviet Union placed nukes in Cuba, why did the US react as aggressively and nervously as it did? After all, the nukes were harmless to the US internal security. They were there to contain the US external influence against Cuba. When has Cuba ever threatened internal security of the US? Jokes aside, I am not sure whether you are being genuine or being difficult on purpose. Any country that has spare resources will try to create a buffer zone around itself in order to counter possible future threats. It seems self-explanatory. American military is in the region doing the same thing - building a buffer zone around China. I think Americans refer to it as "containment", but it's literally the same concept.
- ericmay 5y ago
  > Where I live in the Midwest USA, nobody would care if Hawai'i claimed its independence in some not-harmful-to-tourists-nor-threatening-to-military-fuel-depots fashion. Also Midwest/Great Lakes and I’m not sure about that. I know I’d be pretty upset about it just as I would be if Texas tried to seriously secede or similar. I wonder what a poll would show? I hadn’t thought about Hawaii like you have but it would be interesting. I was stationed there too. It felt like America on an island. It was weird. The Us would never let it happen though. Too strategically important
- gorgoiler 5y ago
  You might if Fort Knox was in Oahu. Taiwan still has 400+ tonnes of gold the Guomindang took with them on their way out. I have no idea if good reserves have any relevance in this century but it’s just one part of the long term animosity.
carapace 5y ago
FWIW in re: the US and Hawaii, a more appropriate metaphor would be China and Tibet.
GekkePrutser 5y ago
> People in mainland see Taiwan as a region of China that tries to be independent. They've been 'trying' pretty successfully since 1949 :) Maybe it's time to just cut your losses instead of trying to rebuild the past. You can pretend they're just a territory that wants independence but really the PRC has had no control over it for 72 years.

dustintrex 5y ago

And the real shame is that nobody seems to care what the people in Taiwan themselves want. (Which, overwhelmingly, is to be independent and free to go their own way.)

jessaustin 5y ago

For a mainlander, Taiwan _is_ a region of China, think of it as Hawai for the US. Where I live in the Midwest USA, nobody would care if Hawai'i claimed its independence in some not-harmful-to-tourists-nor-threatening-to-military-fuel-depots fashion. That doesn't mean it would be easy. Much as was seen in the original USA annexation of Hawai'i, it is very common for interested parties to create violence where none naturally exists.

sudosysgen 5y ago
The issue is that Taiwan is military necessary. If the US is allowed an outpost there they will use the encirclement to threaten China's security.
- mthoms 5y ago
  That’s a pretty bold statement. When has the US ever threatened China’s internal security?
  - sudosysgen 5y ago
    Did you forget the Cold War before Nixon? The Korean War? Even today various officials in the US military are discussion how best to militarily contain China.
    - mthoms 5y ago
      Which of those relates to Chinese internal security? In other words - aside from containing Chinese/Communist external influence, when has the US threatened China? Note: I'm not justifying or condemning any of those "external" actions by the US, I'm just curious if you can illustrate a past or ongoing threat to China proper?
      - throwaway14942 5y ago
        When the Soviet Union placed nukes in Cuba, why did the US react as aggressively and nervously as it did? After all, the nukes were harmless to the US internal security. They were there to contain the US external influence against Cuba. When has Cuba ever threatened internal security of the US? Jokes aside, I am not sure whether you are being genuine or being difficult on purpose. Any country that has spare resources will try to create a buffer zone around itself in order to counter possible future threats. It seems self-explanatory. American military is in the region doing the same thing - building a buffer zone around China. I think Americans refer to it as "containment", but it's literally the same concept.
ericmay 5y ago
> Where I live in the Midwest USA, nobody would care if Hawai'i claimed its independence in some not-harmful-to-tourists-nor-threatening-to-military-fuel-depots fashion. Also Midwest/Great Lakes and I’m not sure about that. I know I’d be pretty upset about it just as I would be if Texas tried to seriously secede or similar. I wonder what a poll would show? I hadn’t thought about Hawaii like you have but it would be interesting. I was stationed there too. It felt like America on an island. It was weird. The Us would never let it happen though. Too strategically important
gorgoiler 5y ago
You might if Fort Knox was in Oahu. Taiwan still has 400+ tonnes of gold the Guomindang took with them on their way out. I have no idea if good reserves have any relevance in this century but it’s just one part of the long term animosity.

carapace 5y ago

FWIW in re: the US and Hawaii, a more appropriate metaphor would be China and Tibet.

GekkePrutser 5y ago

> People in mainland see Taiwan as a region of China that tries to be independent. They've been 'trying' pretty successfully since 1949 :) Maybe it's time to just cut your losses instead of trying to rebuild the past. You can pretend they're just a territory that wants independence but really the PRC has had no control over it for 72 years.