3 ms·

Or, do not endorse people's bad buying patterns. I do care about crappy network and load times. But there's some laptop that have worse performances than three

Or, do not endorse people's bad buying patterns. I do care about crappy network and load times. But there's some laptop that have worse performances than three years old tablets, and there seems to be no end to what scummy companies sell at low end. At some point down the crappy pit, there's a line where it's no longer my problem.

grishka 5y ago
It's not that hard to write optimized software if you know what you're doing. Problem is, developers these days routinely prioritize their own experience over their user's. They would add a huge library just to use one function from it. They would put multiple abstraction layers they don't understand on top of their platform just so their code is "beautiful". They would use their platform in a suboptimal way (for example, moving a DOM element using position instead of transform). And so on. I mean, I know a guy who recently got into frontend development with react. I did the backend for an app he was building. I had to explain him what an XMLHttpRequest is so he could send me one. It just blows my mind that there are people who legit write code with some framework but don't know the basics of the language they're writing in and/or the platform the whole thing runs on.
- avereveard 5y ago
  What condescending bullshit.
  - grishka 5y ago
    What do you even mean? A website has no business to have minimum system requirements. It's a hypertext document with some optional macros here and there.
    - avereveard 5y ago
      Absolutely trivial to demonstrate to be false. I can use websites to videoconferencing. Streaming considered video and audio comes with non trivial loads. I can use websites to compress images, to compute tabulated data on various Excel clones, remotely control devices or play games. This isn't 1995 and we're way past indulging user lazy choices which have us a decade of internet explorer nightmares. Web is much more than that, and one need to know where to draw the line where their products minimum requirement lies.
      - grishka 5y ago
        > I can use websites to videoconferencing. > I can use websites to compress images, to compute tabulated data on various Excel clones, remotely control devices or play games. You sure can, but you probably shouldn't. These use cases are much better served by native apps. Shoehorning hypertext documents with macros into being applications will never come close to writing proper applications, in terms of both UX and performance. I really wish we would undo many of the "advancements" of the web technology. This scope creep needs to stop, yesterday. I wish there to be an answer to a simple question: when is a web browser finished?
        avereveard 5y ago
        What you talking about? App delivery trough browser is what enabled the low cost zero friction startup world you see today, and we're all better for it.
        grishka 5y ago
        I don't want "low cost zero friction startup world", I want completed products that actually work, ffs.
        avereveard 5y ago
        we've been there, 1 in 20 household could afford to tech up, and even less could spare for anything but the most essential software. acquiring a cad or photoshop license was a significant percentage of yearly earning, and renting platforms was unheard of. you say you do, but you don't.
        grishka 5y ago
        Heh, buying software for personal use? Maybe I'm too Russian to understand that. We pirate everything for personal use. Only companies pay for licenses. And allegedly, Adobe and such were fine with that, up until shareholders decided they need to monetize more aggressively to "grow".
aww_dang 5y ago
"If it isn't broken, don't fix it" There's an argument for rampant consumption as a toxic buying pattern. If we are upgrading our systems just to use bloated webpages - webpages that offer nothing of substance over webpages circa 20 years ago, then it is worth asking what we are really gaining. In any transaction it is important to distinguish between what is being sold, what is actually delivered and the utility provided.

grishka 5y ago

It's not that hard to write optimized software if you know what you're doing. Problem is, developers these days routinely prioritize their own experience over their user's. They would add a huge library just to use one function from it. They would put multiple abstraction layers they don't understand on top of their platform just so their code is "beautiful". They would use their platform in a suboptimal way (for example, moving a DOM element using position instead of transform). And so on. I mean, I know a guy who recently got into frontend development with react. I did the backend for an app he was building. I had to explain him what an XMLHttpRequest is so he could send me one. It just blows my mind that there are people who legit write code with some framework but don't know the basics of the language they're writing in and/or the platform the whole thing runs on.

avereveard 5y ago
What condescending bullshit.
- grishka 5y ago
  What do you even mean? A website has no business to have minimum system requirements. It's a hypertext document with some optional macros here and there.
  - avereveard 5y ago
    Absolutely trivial to demonstrate to be false. I can use websites to videoconferencing. Streaming considered video and audio comes with non trivial loads. I can use websites to compress images, to compute tabulated data on various Excel clones, remotely control devices or play games. This isn't 1995 and we're way past indulging user lazy choices which have us a decade of internet explorer nightmares. Web is much more than that, and one need to know where to draw the line where their products minimum requirement lies.
    - grishka 5y ago
      > I can use websites to videoconferencing. > I can use websites to compress images, to compute tabulated data on various Excel clones, remotely control devices or play games. You sure can, but you probably shouldn't. These use cases are much better served by native apps. Shoehorning hypertext documents with macros into being applications will never come close to writing proper applications, in terms of both UX and performance. I really wish we would undo many of the "advancements" of the web technology. This scope creep needs to stop, yesterday. I wish there to be an answer to a simple question: when is a web browser finished?
      - avereveard 5y ago
        What you talking about? App delivery trough browser is what enabled the low cost zero friction startup world you see today, and we're all better for it.
        grishka 5y ago
        I don't want "low cost zero friction startup world", I want completed products that actually work, ffs.
        avereveard 5y ago
        we've been there, 1 in 20 household could afford to tech up, and even less could spare for anything but the most essential software. acquiring a cad or photoshop license was a significant percentage of yearly earning, and renting platforms was unheard of. you say you do, but you don't.
        grishka 5y ago
        Heh, buying software for personal use? Maybe I'm too Russian to understand that. We pirate everything for personal use. Only companies pay for licenses. And allegedly, Adobe and such were fine with that, up until shareholders decided they need to monetize more aggressively to "grow".

aww_dang 5y ago

"If it isn't broken, don't fix it" There's an argument for rampant consumption as a toxic buying pattern. If we are upgrading our systems just to use bloated webpages - webpages that offer nothing of substance over webpages circa 20 years ago, then it is worth asking what we are really gaining. In any transaction it is important to distinguish between what is being sold, what is actually delivered and the utility provided.